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Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

schools.nyc.gov

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Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#451

Post by TuringNYC »

adrr wrote: post #417
TuringNYC wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Totally agreed. But for those who feel the need to justify costs -- instead of looking at the good it does -- consider the capitalist benefits: - Hungry people are not productive to the economy - Hungry people are more likely to be sick and burden the healthcare system - Hungry people, if desperate enough, might steal from you - Hungry children do not learn as well, and become a future burden society needs to carry

Are people going hungry in the US? Obesity rates are at an all time high and the highest in the population below the poverty line. What metric should we look at in terms of quantifying people going hungry?

The US absolutely has a hunger problem. I can personally attest to this as I slept hungry numerous nights from age 11 to 16 (until i was on college meals.) School lunch covered breakfast and lunch, but dinner is on you.

If your wages are growing slower than rent/heating/electricity/etc you suddenly have to chip into your hierarchy of needs (as I later found out my parents did)

The problem with programs in the US is often means testing in the US. It is a corrupt system that makes things very difficult for honest people while perpetuating fraud for insiders and friends.

Bureaucrats in NYC (in my case) made it near impossible to get Food Stamps for some time -- then you go to the grocery store and see someone in Nike Air Jordans ($200+ in the 1990s!!!) whip out food stamps. You see people check out with food stamps and go into a BMW in the parking lot. I grew up in South Brooklyn and was constantly infuriated not only at poverty but those who took advantage of systems to combat it -- and corrupt bureaucrats who enabled corrupt users. A lot came down to hidden social clubs of fraudsters.

Obesity is a separate problem. Often the poor don't have access to quality calories, so they fill themselves with the most affordable calories (low priced carbs.) Eating healthy is a luxury.

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#452

Post by Scoundreller »

3fe9a03ccd14ca5 wrote: post #130
Frost1x wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have food banks in the US. Many are under heavy stress right now from what I understand. At least one food bank near me has already expressed needs for donations through local media sources.

The sad reality is that the supply chain is all messed up and there’s weird expectations still with food banks. For example, I can’t take my 50 lb bag of rice and divide it up into 5 lb bags because of food safety issues and regulations. So rather than getting a huge shipment of some grain and doing that, they’re stuck scrounging for the small stuff. They’re also still tossing expired foods even though Best By dates…

> I can’t take my 50 lb bag of rice and divide it up into 5 lb bags because of food safety issues and regulations.

While the food bank can’t, you and your friends can split things up.

Even if you can’t, if you’re getting 500calories a day from rice for 1 person, 50lbs will run out in 6 months.

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#453

Post by Scoundreller »

pmoriarty wrote: post #235
Melting_Harps wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Feeding people will always be a matter of profit: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-dairy-... . I agree, sadly; I have actually been focused on mitigating the losses inherit in the Supply Chain itself, as on a solely Calorie basis we could easily feed the entire population, and is for the most part already at a post-scarcity level despite all the turmoil with Factory Farming and especially State…

"milk can’t be frozen, like meat, or stuck in a silo, like grain" ...but it can be dried. I bought some powdered milk during my preparation and have been using it to cook with, for which it's been great. In a pinch you can drink it, or use it to extend fresh milk, if you have any. It can be stored for a long time, too. I know it's not ideal, but it's better than throwing milk away.

Or do what we’ve done for millennia: make cheese.

Hard to DIY (I think? Or I overestimate), but at an industrial scale, already a thing.

Takes up a lot less space too.

Finally, milk can be UHT’d and is then shelf stable for ~40 weeks. Then is starts to form sediments... dunno if that’s actually bad.

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#454

Post by 205guy »

This reminds me of the government run Amma Canteens in parts of India. Interestingly, they are not free but very low cost: 5 rupees or $0.07 for a plate of curry. Apparently this is 20-25% of the cost of equivalent food from a private vendor.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amma_Unavagam

https://www.thebetterindia.com/79947/low-cost-canteens-amma-...

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#455

Post by Consultant32452 »

ball_of_lint wrote: post #424
Consultant32452 wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When someone runs out isn't the relevant stat. A person could receive $100/day and still run out in 17 days if they are ridiculous. The real question is can a person reasonably feed themselves on $4/day. I would submit the answer is 100% yes for the vast, vast majority of locations in the US. You can do your own web search for the litany of sites/postings on how to eat on Here's one sample site: https://www.budgetsar…

You can feed yourself for $4/day if you already have: - Cooking supplies (pots, pans, plates, silverware, etc) - 1h+ / day of free time to spend on cooking and shopping for food - A fridge and pantry to store food in - An oven and/or stove to cook your food For a significant number of people that cannot afford to feed themselves, one or more of these are compounding factors. By providing meals instead of $, this prog…

This is an awful "gotcha" straw man. It's not reasonable to expect every person in every response to cover every case. No communication would occur if we held everyone to that bar.

If a person needs a prepared meal they can go to a soup kitchen which is also funded by taxes. Forcing everyone to that model would be really authoritarian. I'd much rather let people get what they want to the extent possible.

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#456

Post by adrr »

Loughla wrote: post #425
adrr wrote: post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are people going hungry in the US? Obesity rates are at an all time high and the highest in the population below the poverty line. What metric should we look at in terms of quantifying people going hungry?

Just as a note on this - low income have higher obesity rates, because many of them live in food deserts, without access to quality produce, or other regular staples. Further, high-calorie, low nutrition foods are cheaper in the US, and therefore more accessible. Fat people =/= healthy distribution system of food.

Curious on this food desert thing. Is access to food less than it was 50 years ago? Access to fruits and vegetables during winter/fall months is a new thing since now we have better supply chains and international trade(winter crop is from Mexico).

Its weird to me since i grew up in Saudi Arabia on a compound, a true food desert and lived off powdered milk, ramen, and other non perishable foods we could buy from the commissary store. There is something like 5000 Walmarts in the US that covers 90% of the population. They have fresh vegetables and fruits all year round.

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#457

Post by umvi »

organsnyder wrote: post #418
umvi wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well then we may need to restructure in order to create a more effective system. Society does not benefit from people who are completely reliant on the government to meet basic needs.

That's an untested assertion. It's possible that society actually would benefit from every person being freed up from the stress and distraction of worrying about how to pay for basic necessities. Imagine how much creativity is being squandered by people being forced to work whatever job they can find just to make ends meet.

It's being tested right now. How many people are using their newfound quarantine free time to do creative work vs. watching trendy documentaries on Netflix? I have friends collecting unemployment benefits complaining on facebook how bored they are and playing WoW all day.

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#458

Post by vb6sp6 »

oh_sigh wrote: post #448
vb6sp6 wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to read past the first sentence "A food desert is an area that has limited access to affordable and nutritious food,[1][2][3] in contrast with an area with higher access to supermarkets or vegetable shops with fresh foods, which is called a food oasis.[4] The designation considers the type and quality of food available to the population, in addition to the accessibility of the food through the size and proxi…

What does that have to do with boxed food at gas stations?

Are you just being pedantic?

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#459

Post by zbyte64 »

Scoundreller wrote: post #435
b34r wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s possible with the 5 minute Abbott machines that are starting to be distributed

Makes you wonder if you could pool together a bunch of low-risk samples, and only re-test if the pool comes back positive.

Sounds like a binary search problem, problem is we would need larger samples >:)

Re: Three free meals available daily for any New Yorker

#460

Post by gruez »

bosie wrote: post #438
gruez wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So going back to your earlier comment: >>UBI isn't a savior. UBI still requires that people, you know, pay taxes. If 30-40% of people have no income and are completely dependent upon the government, then you have slavery 2.0 (3.0?) and you will end up creating a worse, classed society than you had before: the ones receiving vs. those who pay for what everyone else gets. >Regarding your first paragraph: At least in a…

because the argument was that with UBI you would have a loss of income tax and since that is the only tax available to the government, you have a complete loss of tax. if you are shifting to a consumption tax, you would not have a loss.

>if you are shifting to a consumption tax, you would not have a loss.

Isn't that just a matter of accounting? If you're going to give people free money, then tax them on it, it's equivalent to simply giving them less free money. In the end you're still taxing the working people.

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