Introduction to Permaculture (1994) • Hacker News Board

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#11

Post by mceoin » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 8:39 AM UTC

blunte wrote: post #8

fouc wrote: post #5

It's interesting that Permaculture is already more than 26 years old. It's got quite a number ideas that probably seem very controversial to the average gardener or small farmer. But the genius of Permaculture is that it's also way less effort. Work with nature, rather than fight it. Chop and drop. Pull out weeds then drop them on the ground, let it turn into mulch.

> seem very controversial It's just a matter of experience and perspective. Many of the permaculture principles have been practiced since long before industrialization. In the scale of human existence, the current "normal" agriculture practices are abnormal, while permaculture is normal. Also, don't cut the weeds unless you have a very good reason. Even the definition of "weed" is questionable. Most of the time, the…

Totally agree. "Permaculture" was really just Mollison - a genius and veteran biologist - collating all the best practices and strategies he had observed from land-based cultures, then codifying this knowledge of what works. (Hence, "permanent agriculture".) It couldn't be less controversial.

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#12

Post by mceoin » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 8:41 AM UTC

dbmueller wrote: post #7

So, I guess in the meantime some developments on the idea have been made. What would a modern intro/reference be?

Elinor Ostrom's 8 Principles for Managing the Commons deserves a mention and deserves inclusion in future additions.

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#13

Post by dntbnmpls » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 8:42 AM UTC

fouc wrote: post #5

It's interesting that Permaculture is already more than 26 years old. It's got quite a number ideas that probably seem very controversial to the average gardener or small farmer. But the genius of Permaculture is that it's also way less effort. Work with nature, rather than fight it. Chop and drop. Pull out weeds then drop them on the ground, let it turn into mulch.

> It's interesting that Permaculture is already more than 26 years old.

The date actually had me wondering. At what point do we start to refer to 1994 as the "1900s". We are already 2 decades into the 2000s, but it feels strange to refer to 1994 as the 1900s? Wonder which decade in the 1900s people started feeling comfortable referring to 1894 as "the 1800s".

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#14

Post by johnpowell » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 8:42 AM UTC

I bought this book at a place called "Hungry Head Books" in Eugene Oregon in 1997. I was working as a projectionist at the time and pretty much had to kill 30 hours a week in the booth. This was before wifi or cell phones so I would buy a few books each week and just sit on the carpet and read while the projectors did their thing.

I was not a fan of the hippies. I lived on 15th and High (that is not a joke) when Jerry Garcia died. The hippies were lost for a bit so they flooded 13th in Eugene until they found Phish and moved on. It was horrible. I'm more of a punk rock guy.

But this book really got me going about permaculture. To the point where it was all I would talk about when I got drunk at parties. And people hated me for it. I guess I know how the bitcoin guys feel.

But I found out my aunt and uncle owned about a hundred acres near Klamath Falls. And they were cool with me doing whatever out there. Tons of lumber and there was already a well. So over a summer we built a cabin with working plumbing and a septic tank. And by cabin I mean the unibomber would have considered it a downgrade. We had no clue about what we were doing.

But it was fun to camp out and build something, even if it was shit. That was about as far as we got. There is now a rotting log cabin out there.

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#15

Post by zeristor » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 8:54 AM UTC

johnpowell wrote: post #14

I bought this book at a place called "Hungry Head Books" in Eugene Oregon in 1997. I was working as a projectionist at the time and pretty much had to kill 30 hours a week in the booth. This was before wifi or cell phones so I would buy a few books each week and just sit on the carpet and read while the projectors did their thing. I was not a fan of the hippies. I lived on 15th and High (that is not a joke) when Jerr…

I found this book in the "Books for a Change" book shop in Charing Cross Road back in 90s. I loved the diagrams.

A lament for that book shop, and for all the many book shops on Charing Cross Road which have closed down.

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#16

Post by stareatgoats » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 9:11 AM UTC

johnpowell wrote: post #14

I bought this book at a place called "Hungry Head Books" in Eugene Oregon in 1997. I was working as a projectionist at the time and pretty much had to kill 30 hours a week in the booth. This was before wifi or cell phones so I would buy a few books each week and just sit on the carpet and read while the projectors did their thing. I was not a fan of the hippies. I lived on 15th and High (that is not a joke) when Jerr…

Thanks for a cool read! Love permaculture too, and will never be a farmer either, I'll stick to coding. But you might consider taking up writing!

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#17

Post by raptorraver » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 9:22 AM UTC

dbmueller wrote: post #7

So, I guess in the meantime some developments on the idea have been made. What would a modern intro/reference be?

I'd also recommend book that's developed the ideas of the Permaculture further to suit better for farming: https://www.regenerativeagriculture.co/ Just bought the book and it's a very thorough and practical guide on how to run small farm profitabily while building new soil and implementing Permaculture patterns. Richard Perkings who has written the book is a pioneer in regenerative agriculture and runs his own farm at Sweden (https://youtu.be/J_htLIUKX1Y) He explains the principles and theories behind his farm in this great lecture he kept at food-related hackaton: https://youtu.be/3Knn7ZH4Tiw

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#18

Post by blunte » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 9:39 AM UTC

mceoin wrote: post #10

Shoutout to plantabundance.com - 8yr YouTube journey turning a Bay Area, California backyard into a fully abundant landscape, starting from scratch. I recommend starting with his yearly backyard tours like this one https://youtu.be/L5RfruUjL1w

Thanks for the share. This is great.

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#19

Post by michaelscott2 » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 10:09 AM UTC

dbmueller wrote: post #7

So, I guess in the meantime some developments on the idea have been made. What would a modern intro/reference be?

There is a good active community and resources at https://permies.com/

Re: Introduction to Permaculture (1994)

#20

Post by numbsafari » Fri, Apr 03, 2020, 10:33 AM UTC

I enrolled my wife and I in a local Permaculture Design Course as part of a Christmas present (she got us into bees last year). Unlike most 2-week intensives, ours is taught every other weekend for about 3 months.

I think many people here on HN would be interested in permaculture. There’s a lot of the same design and systems thinking that appeal to computer programmers. As noted by others, permaculture is also really into the hacker ethic.

It scales up and down really nicely, and can fit into your urban, small apartment lifestyle, or your suburban backyard, small acreage, or even big farms.

What it has me thinking about most, is what set of ethics and principles can/should I take to my practice as a software engineer. Permaculture is a design method based in a set of simple ethics, that lead to a set of basic principles, that help you select, adapt, and use various practices.

Is there a “earth share, people share, fair share” set of ethics that could become the basis for how you solve tech problems? Is anyone familiar with an existing author or community that seeks to address this in tech? Would love references.