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Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

superhighway98.com

161–170 of 280 posts

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#161
IMHO Google has been in decline since ~2010 or so, but it's only recently that the dive in quality became very noticeable. Try searching for anything even mildly technical outside of software, and you are presented with pages upon pages of completely irrelevant SEO spam. Automotive repair manuals (for very old cars) are one example; it used to be that you could easily find a link to a PDF, and the results were otherwise mostly relevant; but now you get only sites claiming to sell it to you, and more SEO spam.

Two more examples are error messages and IC part markings --- searches are flooded with results that do not even contain all the words in the query. I didn't put those words there for no reason, ignoring them is absolutely unacceptable. This becomes ridiculous when you search for error numbers, where a search containing the exact number and the word "error" gets flooded with plenty of useless results about other errors.

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#163

IMHO Google has been in decline since ~2010 or so, but it's only recently that the dive in quality became very noticeable. Try searching for anything even mildly technical outside of software, and you are presented with pages upon pages of completely irrelevant SEO spam. Automotive repair manuals (for very old cars) are one example; it used to be that you could easily find a link to a PDF, and the results were otherw…

I'm just glad I'm not alone, sometimes I second guess if I am the problem.

Currently just to get basically workable results I'm finding myself putting "every" "keyword" "in" "quotes" (to make sure they're actually in the result pages at all), the site: modifier to restrict it to real sites, and negative modifiers (-"keyword") to remove some SEO results.

Google used to be "magic" in that it knew what you were thinking, and gave you what you wanted instead of what you asked for. These days it is just page after page of auto-generated results, pages that don't contain anything relevant to your query, or just low quality results.

I'm not going to pretend I'm an expert in Google's search, and I'm sure they're meeting some metric or another, but from my perspective things have gone seriously downhill to the point where I am looking elsewhere.

It used to be THE technical search engine de jure. Now it feels like a search engine you have to hack to get it to work well. Not a good place to be.

PS - I have read, in HN comments (so pure rumor) from self-proclaimed ex-Googlers, that Google's internal culture punishes people for improvements/maintenance to existing products, and that promotions come from developing new products/features. If even semi-accurate might go a long way to explaining why Google Search feels neglected aside from changes which seem to exist to improve their button line/promote sister products.

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#164
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know about the “politically correct” comment, but the one thing I would ask of google if I could ask for something that they would deliver is to ALWAYS return results where ALL of my search terms are included. It doesn’t have to be verbatim, I’m good with them doing conjugations and maybe synonym matching, but if I add a qualifier to my search query, I didn’t add it because I don’t need it. This is my biggest…

Just add '+' sign before each keyword- seems to be working. I tried a sequence of 10 or so random and made-up words to see if it will find anything.while it returns results, it does it on a shorter search and it also says at the top that no results were found for this query.Then I started removing one keyword at the time and return the search. Eventually it found a matching result and it contains all four words from…

The '+' operator was deprecated in 2011 [0].

Based on Google’s advanced operator page at one point, the addition of a plus sign to a search termed either prompted the lookup of Google+ pages or a blood type.

'+' was replaced by adding quotes around each search term.

[0] https://googlesystem.blogspot.com/2011/10/googles-plus-opera...

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#165

IMHO Google has been in decline since ~2010 or so, but it's only recently that the dive in quality became very noticeable. Try searching for anything even mildly technical outside of software, and you are presented with pages upon pages of completely irrelevant SEO spam. Automotive repair manuals (for very old cars) are one example; it used to be that you could easily find a link to a PDF, and the results were otherw…

Been desperately trying to get information on some retrocomputing equipment I bought and Google has been next to useless. Except for handful of results (no more than a dozen) majority of results seem to be websites that scrape Ebay listings and rehost that information. Much of the content that supposedly matched, but was behind a paywall and it was difficult to tell if it would be any useful offhand.

To be fair, in my case the lack of information is real (I've gotten only a minuscule amount of info by asking on niche forums sadly), but cutting out the noise early would be helpful.

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#166

IMHO Google has been in decline since ~2010 or so, but it's only recently that the dive in quality became very noticeable. Try searching for anything even mildly technical outside of software, and you are presented with pages upon pages of completely irrelevant SEO spam. Automotive repair manuals (for very old cars) are one example; it used to be that you could easily find a link to a PDF, and the results were otherw…

I'm just glad I'm not alone, sometimes I second guess if I am the problem. Currently just to get basically workable results I'm finding myself putting "every" "keyword" "in" "quotes" (to make sure they're actually in the result pages at all), the site: modifier to restrict it to real sites, and negative modifiers (-"keyword") to remove some SEO results. Google used to be "magic" in that it knew what you were thinking…

Basically now we're back to forcing Google to work the way AltaVista did in 1997.

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#167

IMHO Google has been in decline since ~2010 or so, but it's only recently that the dive in quality became very noticeable. Try searching for anything even mildly technical outside of software, and you are presented with pages upon pages of completely irrelevant SEO spam. Automotive repair manuals (for very old cars) are one example; it used to be that you could easily find a link to a PDF, and the results were otherw…

Fully agree with you, Google -as a lot of us expected- has turned into a corporate scourge.

Which makes their mission statement "to organize the world's information and make it universally accessible and useful" come across like a bad joke. They really should update it since they don't even bother to keep up appearances anymore.

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#168
post #77

In my opinion, "the Feed" ruined the internet. The news feed, the Twitter feed, the Reddit feed, etc. The addictive nature of the Feed, and the tendency to reward dramatic or outrageous or ridiculous content leads to the herd mentality and mindless dogpiling that occurs on these platforms. And then, because expression is compressed into short form soundbites, pics and videos, the platforms actively inhibit constructi…

What I would like to see is a way to build charters and algorithmicly enforced governments, and then fork communities when divide exceeds concensus. What I mean by this is a subreddit where you can choose how votes are tallied, and instead of a fiefdom, becomes an open source template for other communities who can inherit the historical record. When you create the community, it gives you a mad libs style page, where…

Sounds good. If you build it I'll use it.

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#169
post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What people don't like to admit is that Google, YouTube, Reddit and Facebook all prioritize market share above some odd gatekeeping ideal that people have decided an idealized internet should be. They've turned it into a MacDonald's instead of a Tavern on the Green, because that's what most people find accessable even though it's worse in almost every way. But, Tavern on the Green could not serve the same number of p…

Personally I just think google is losing to seo because google is playing it too neutral and not opinionated enough. Like facebook, they want decisions to look like math chose the answer, and not people, because they want to deflect accusations of bias. Google would be better if it were more opinionated. I go there because I WANT them to rank results and tell me what they think are the best quality answers. Google ma…

They can put in optimization and skew the results with opinion, but not doing that might have more to do with lawyers than desire. There is a keen eye on their search results as far as political and business results are concerned.

Re: Google emphasizes popularity over accuracy

#170
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I support the author here. There was a promise of a marketplace of ideas, making the world a better place, that being interconnected would make the world smarter and democratize knowledge. All that may be true, it may be out there, but it's damn hard to find. Google, Youtube, Reddit, and Facebook all prioritize freshness. Instead of being exposed to things outside our comfort zones, we take solace protected inside fi…

> There was a promise of a marketplace of ideas Said commenter, as they type a comment in a marketplace of ideas where people discuss fairly complex ideas. The internet is a tool, not a solution. I absolutely disagree that it's hard to find for anyone looking for it. The issue is that most people aren't looking for it, and you can't force them. A lot of people are just looking for entertainment, and that's perfectly…

I feel for you in empathizing for people's ability to just have what they want, but... I worry about it too. (I say all this with compassion and a non-confrontational tone.)

> The issue is that most people aren't looking for [a marketplace of ideas], and you can't force them

No? We can't? Or we shouldn't? Might that be our hyper-individualist culture constraining our imagination of what the right path (survival) might be?

Our evolution within terrestrial physical reality "forced" us to participate in well-calibrated local marketplaces of ideas, and our psychology evolved specifically so that we had a fine-tuned balance of what we subjectively "wanted" and what we found ourselves coming to believe, despite that initial-condition "want" -- dissenting views in a room have both a repulsion but also a very specific gravity -- a closeness that emerges amongst holders of opposing ideas, when these ideas have manifested and are walking around in human bodies within shared meatspace -- we start to empathize with holders of countering views that we're forced to share physical space with. We talk about empathy like it's feelings for the other pieces of meat, but it's perhaps better conceived as a kinship of one tight bundle of ideas for another. It's evolved and it's ancient and it's a very specific foraging strategy for 2D terrestrial creatures finding information/food under those constraints.

And now, we've designed systems that aren't nearly as clever and well-calibrated as our meatspace selves evolved to be. In the purely physical space we evolved for, we had to share space with people we probably disagreed with, and we developed unique tendencies based on the nature of living on a 2D terrestrial plane. Heck, we'd have different psychology favoured if we made it to this level of the great filter, but happened to evolve in the air (3D grid) or within a more one-dimensional environment or some hyperdimensional space.

Speaking of high-dimensional space: enter the internet. Might our prior foraging strategies and adaptations stacked onto our prior foraging strategies... might they fail now? Foraging strategies are informed by the math of the landscape. (search terms: optimal foraging strategies, radius of perception, levy walk, agent-based modeling, in the vein of [1]) Our psychology is tailored to adapting to physical reality on a plane, and the internet might totally fuck that up. (What is an internet bubble? Maybe it's just my stepping out of the 2D terrestrial grid and engaging through a hidden, non-spatial dimension with some foraging target I can sense near me?) It's like all places are piped into one another, outside physical reality. This isn't Kansas. It's the formation of a hyperdimensional object. It's no longer a 2D grid, and our predispositions and adaptations for navigating such a grid might drive us to extinction.

imho, we DO need to consider "forcing" (as a collective) changes in that infrastructure, or else our hitherto evolved psychology might just as well see us destroyed. So in the end, what people "want" is maybe not the highest principle to hold, because what we individually "want" might be tuned for a dying reality, and a prior foraging landscape.

Heh, anyhow... perhaps this is just a mad-cap rant from a technologist and failed biochemist [1]: https://par.nsf.gov/servlets/purl/10135146

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