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Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

smithsonianmag.com

21–30 of 83 posts

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#21
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will post this at the risk of being downvoted because I am all but a pacifist and it is not a popular position. This is not surprising at all for two reasons. Despite what films will depict, people fighting on the front lines in a war do not generally begrudgingly respect each other. They hate eachother in a way most people probably cannot understand. Many would not pass up the opportunity to rid the world of what…

>Despite what films will depict, people fighting on the front lines in a war do not have a begrudgingly respect for each other. They hate eachother in a way most people probably cannot understand. Many would not pass up the opportunity to rid the world of what they see as the most evil upon its face unto the very last minute. So... either you're some kind of omniscient telepath, or you're making this insight of yours…

No. I have read a lot of history books which delve into diaries and correspondence of individuals fighting in front line situations. The respectful weighing of the other side's reasons for fighting is overwhelmed by a desire to kill them in graphic and brutal ways.

This is a product of putting people under the pressure of fear of death for hours, days or weeks at a time, propagandizing the enemy as less than human and trauma from the loss of loved ones at the hands of what in modern war is an unknown enemy.

This understanding escapes us in popular culture. It isn't often that HBO series or history books focus on the enmity that abides long after conflict has ceased. Those who return from war with hate still in them are our 'Taxi Driver' type villains or freaks. We don't reckon that to a certain extent everyone we send into combat has hate in them.

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will post this at the risk of being downvoted because I am all but a pacifist and it is not a popular position. This is not surprising at all for two reasons. Despite what films will depict, people fighting on the front lines in a war do not generally begrudgingly respect each other. They hate eachother in a way most people probably cannot understand. Many would not pass up the opportunity to rid the world of what…

My dad fought in WW2 and I have overhead quite a few conversations about the war. Most soldiers just wanted to go home in one piece and did whatever it took to do so.

My father fought in Vietnam and that is how he began. By the time he left he wanted to kill as many VC as possible or leave or whatever but that is one man's experience.

Are you so sure that if you had been able to ask your father immediately after his return what he thought of the Germans or the Japanese he'd tell the same story?

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#23
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will post this at the risk of being downvoted because I am all but a pacifist and it is not a popular position. This is not surprising at all for two reasons. Despite what films will depict, people fighting on the front lines in a war do not generally begrudgingly respect each other. They hate eachother in a way most people probably cannot understand. Many would not pass up the opportunity to rid the world of what…

The 1914 Christmas truce demonstrates otherwise as five months of fighting was insufficient to guarantee hate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_truce It’s surprisingly difficult to train civilians to kill each other, but governments have discovered how. You don’t do it on the front lines, you do it before they get to the battle field.

December 1914 was a very different world upon the front lines of WWI from Movember 1918. People still thought that war would looks something like the Franco-Prussian War.

> You don’t do it on the front lines, you do it before they get to the battle field.

I think you do it by exposing people to years of misery and loss. But a boatload of propaganda doesn't hurt.

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#24
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Despite what films will depict, people fighting on the front lines in a war do not have a begrudgingly respect for each other. They hate eachother in a way most people probably cannot understand. Many would not pass up the opportunity to rid the world of what they see as the most evil upon its face unto the very last minute. So... either you're some kind of omniscient telepath, or you're making this insight of yours…

No. I have read a lot of history books which delve into diaries and correspondence of individuals fighting in front line situations. The respectful weighing of the other side's reasons for fighting is overwhelmed by a desire to kill them in graphic and brutal ways. This is a product of putting people under the pressure of fear of death for hours, days or weeks at a time, propagandizing the enemy as less than human an…

> I have read a lot of history books which delve into diaries and correspondence of individuals fighting in front line situations. The respectful weighing of the other side's reasons for fighting is overwhelmed by a desire to kill them in graphic and brutal ways.

Odd. I've read a lot of war correspondence and history as well, being kind of addicted to that stuff on Youtube, and I haven't encountered the sort of overwhelming pathological hatred and programming you describe be mentioned often enough to assume that it applies as a near-universal constant.

Are you sure you're not just taking one or two instances from, say, World War 2 and the Vietnam War and assuming all war is like Full Metal Jacket or something? It certainly seems like you're projecting.

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#26
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will post this at the risk of being downvoted because I am all but a pacifist and it is not a popular position. This is not surprising at all for two reasons. Despite what films will depict, people fighting on the front lines in a war do not generally begrudgingly respect each other. They hate eachother in a way most people probably cannot understand. Many would not pass up the opportunity to rid the world of what…

I’m not sure that’s true. Apparently very few shots are on target. People seem reluctant to just kill someone else. This “problem” has been ameliorated In recent times via increasingly distant and abstract warfare. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killology#The_problem_of_non-_...

And war is full of atrocities because people just cannot being themselves to do bad things to eachother?

I am not making a basic argument for the goodness or lack thereof in people. Only that war changes the rationale and emotional stability of people. It makes the illogical or unthinkable into the next logical step.

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#27
Like others I found the recording profound at first. The birds at the end cheapened the experience for me because they made me question the authenticity of the sounds heard and whether this was leaning closer to an actual representation or an artistic interpretation. Perhaps somewhere in between.

Assuming that this is leaning closer to an actual representation of the sounds heard on that morning (with the dubious addition of some birds for "dramatic effect") one thing that I found particularly interesting is the noise/buzz that can be heard immediately after the guns are silenced. Could it be that this noise represents the people cheering for the end of war captured by the crude recording device of oil drums + film?

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My dad fought in WW2 and I have overhead quite a few conversations about the war. Most soldiers just wanted to go home in one piece and did whatever it took to do so.

My father fought in Vietnam and that is how he began. By the time he left he wanted to kill as many VC as possible or leave or whatever but that is one man's experience. Are you so sure that if you had been able to ask your father immediately after his return what he thought of the Germans or the Japanese he'd tell the same story?

My dad is German :). Did your dad have a desire to kill VC after going home?

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#29
post #3

I didn't find the audio on that page, but a link to it here: https://codatocoda.bandcamp.com/album/iwm-ww1-armistice-inte... I want to know if the birds were actually recorded at the end, or if it was added for dramatic presentation.

The sounds of guns were recreated. The sounds of birds chirping were clearly added for dramatic effect, and was completely unnecessary -- just silence would have sufficed.

Re: Listen to the moment the guns fell silent ending World War I

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My father fought in Vietnam and that is how he began. By the time he left he wanted to kill as many VC as possible or leave or whatever but that is one man's experience. Are you so sure that if you had been able to ask your father immediately after his return what he thought of the Germans or the Japanese he'd tell the same story?

My dad is German :). Did your dad have a desire to kill VC after going home?

I sometime forget the international nature of the folks on this site. Rephrase that question but about his feelings toward Americans, Englishs or Russians.

To answer your question, yes he did. He was racist amd embittered for many years. Sometime before I was born he began to soften that hate. He is different now but sometimes I still see it beneath the surface.

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