Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

261–270 of 359 posts

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#261

Post by simias »

stronglikedan wrote: post #155
simias wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the EU there is. For instance the company can't normally access directories or emails clearly labelled as "private". Monitoring can occur but it's pretty tightly regulated. See for instance https://gdpr.report/news/2017/11/17/5383/ > * Employers can monitor employees’ emails at work but need to approach this with caution and careful consideration. > * Follow the ICO Code and 29 WP opinion, including conducting a D…

Thanks for the answer. TIL. However, I must say that's just weird to me, because you're not required to use company resources for private matters. The bathroom analogy doesn't really hold in my mind, since it's reasonable to expect privacy in any bathroom, but I see where you're going with that.

I think it's reasonable that if you're going to be in front of a computer for ~8hours a day from time to time you're going to do personal stuff on it. This was especially true a few years ago when smartphones and unlimited data plans weren't quite as common.

I mean sure, if it's the PC controlling some industrial machine you're probably not expected to browse Facebook on it. But if you're some temp working the reception you might have some time to kill even if you do your work properly...

There's also the situation where you're traveling and don't want to carry two laptops from instance.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#262

Post by majkinetor »

treis wrote: post #129
freehunter wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cubicles got so much hate because they were worse than private offices that came before them. Now open floor plans are getting hate because they’re worse than cubicles so rose-colored glasses makes cubicles the nostalgic dream.

I don't think there was ever a time where every office worker had their own office. Only the big boss got their own office and everyone else had desks in a large room. The open floor plan we have now is pretty typical of what they used to look like. Here's a good example: https://www.officemuseum.com/1935_Auditor_of_Overcharge_Clai... More pictures: https://www.officemuseum.com/photo_gallery_1930s_1940s.htm

THere are a bunch of places where 2 to 3 pps are in the office. I never accepted a job that didn't involve me having an office like that.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#263

Post by jedberg »

karatestomp wrote: post #134
sheeshkebab wrote: post #16

“ Frost declined to comment on whether Garrabrants, one of America’s top-paid bank CEOs in 2018, is subject to the same monitoring when he works from home.” Tells it all pretty much...

A lot of “very important” employee-control bullshit suddenly doesn’t matter when the person in question is in a C-level or board position. See also: piss tests, limits on doing other work while with an employer. Very important you’re sober as a judge and giving your company your undivided productive output—unless you’re CEO, then, a weekend habit or two and you’re involved with four companies at once in some capacity…

"It would be a security/compliance/legal violation to screenshot the CxO's screen because they might be working on something materially important to our stock price and we can't risk someone in IT seeing that or leaking it".

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#264

Post by hef19898 »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #106
sbarre wrote: post #6

This happened to me years ago. I was put in an empty office at the opposite end from my boss, and because he couldn't walk up behind me to see me working, he secretly installed a program on my computer that took a screenshot every 30 seconds (or so?). I quickly noticed that my computer was hitching regularly (when the screenshot was taken - this was in the late 90s BTW), and so investigated my computer on a day when…

> because he couldn't walk up behind me to see me working, he secretly installed a program on my computer that took a screenshot every 30 seconds > The irony was that I was probably the most productive person in that office (in my humble opinion). The easiest and the most efficient way to ruin my productivity is to look at my screen. I can't work (nor can I pee - a funny coincidence, that's called "paruresis") when s…

I developed that paranoia over ten years ago in my first real job. The only desk available was the one right next to the door. With the back to the door. Everyone who entered the office had no choice but to stand in my back and look at my desk and screen. Still flinch when someone comes up behind me when I'm working, even it's my kids.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#265

Post by viraptor »

TallGuyShort wrote: post #85
lmilcin wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Wrong mental model. Your best bet is to hire/make/keep people interested in being productive. When this is lost there isn't going much you can do to improve productivity. Keeping employee chained to their desks will not magically make things get done. This is so naive. I wonder how humanity landed in the situation where half of all managers don't get the first thing about managing people.

Given the panic-buy, I'm sure you're right about most people thinking this will keep people productive. I've wanted something like this before, though, when I got some bad people on my team who weren't worth what they were getting paid and were sometimes a net negative on the team. We couldn't fire them because everything was at least somewhat subjective and HR and my own boss wanted a solid case. Oh they didn't get…

This is reaching for some extreme tools, while simpler solution is available. At some company size, network audit is just required. You can get information like "this person is using Facebook all the time" without actually screenshoting their Facebook screen. This solved a lot of privacy issues.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#266

Post by pbhjpbhj »

dylan604 wrote: post #217
hbosch wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree. There are far more reasons for people to not be productive in the office than at home. Making excuses to get coffee, the need to go out for lunch, the drive-bys and time lost walking to/from meetings, moving up and down floors... if the main motivator in your work is the fact that people can swing by and look over your shoulder, then yeah, you're better in an office. At home I wake up and log on at 8am. In…

I think you are greatly ignoring employees with children. It is hard for a 4 year old to understand that when mom & dad are home that it is not a work day. They just want to spend time with mom & dad. In addition, the only thing they know of computers is playing games, so it is hard to see mom & dad on a computer doing "work". Think of the most annoying co-worker you've dealt with constantly coming up to you and aski…

This, so much.

We have a small house, which is fine because I work at the office, they're out at school, it's big enough for the times we need to be there ... oh wait.

Our upstairs is big enough for the beds, and a narrow space around each. Downstairs has no dividing walls/doors.

Now work expect equal output from me and I'm working in the kitchen with a just a gap between me and the room a toddler and 2 other children are occupying.

Perhaps if they weren't my kids, particularly my brain interrupts every time the toddler speaks, because that's how we're wired for young voices.

Now add in that the kids are used to running around screaming, literally screaming, to burn off energy .. it's not going well.

Meanwhile the bosses in their massive home offices, think everything is perfect and don't see why we shouldn't be _more_ productive than normal.

I'm waiting for when we go back wondering how their argument for why we're not allowed to home-work is going to go ...

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#267

Post by someguyorother »

Cpoll wrote: post #233
trhway wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm surprised cubicles get so much hate. cubicles were a step down from individual offices, and was the manifestation of commoditization of the software engineering. The transition from cubicles to open offices was the part of that process going even further. Basically blue collar workers of 196x on a large factory floor. One would think that we've reached the peak of bad offices ... Well, i think some form of verti…

> vertically stacked option Bunk-bed desks.

Coffin hotel offices.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#268

Post by dylan604 »

jdbernard wrote: post #259
dylan604 wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are greatly ignoring employees with children. It is hard for a 4 year old to understand that when mom & dad are home that it is not a work day. They just want to spend time with mom & dad. In addition, the only thing they know of computers is playing games, so it is hard to see mom & dad on a computer doing "work". Think of the most annoying co-worker you've dealt with constantly coming up to you and aski…

The best and most effective way I've found to do this is to have a door that you can lock and a partner who can reassure the kids that dad/mom still cares but is just busy when the door is locked. Of course, people who were not already setup for working remotely may not have a door they can lock and partner who can reassure.

Sure, now what about when both parents are attempting to work from home. It takes a lot more effort to coordinate when both parents need to be on a conference call to attempt to wrangle the kids away/keep quiet enough for the other to make that call.

Kids have routines, and having work-from-home parents can become part of that routine. It's not a light switch though, so training has to be given time to take hold. Probably about the time the seclusion orders are lifted if not longer.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#269

Post by fizixer »

What if a remote employee makes one room available in their home for full monitoring, camera, audio, whatever?

If the employee is not in the room, that's like a break.

Employers monitor cubicles in offices. Would it be worse if the are allowed to monitor one room in the house of a remote employee?

Feel free to discuss. Pros? cons? privacy issues? any other other thoughts, comments.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#270

Post by pbhjpbhj »

wayoutthere wrote: post #125
moosey wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm married with two children and I can assure you that not only has my mental state slipped because of the stresses of home life, but I also lost an enormous amount of social activity that I intentionally maintained in order to keep my brain and health at optimal levels. I am OK, but my productivity is toast.

Not trying to one-up you here as having a family brings different forms of stress I can't speak to, but it's really hard to go for a week without interacting with another human being. Social connection is core to who we are as humans; cutting that off is like removing a limb.

It's interesting, family meets a distinct need. I've started working with technical peers and it's wonderful to be with others who can stretch your understanding, even just know what you're on about if you talk technically.

Entirely different to the mentoring, caring, parenting, intimate interactions with kids (and my wife).

Post reply on HN