Live data from Hacker News

Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

bloomberg.com

101–110 of 359 posts

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#101
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where I live what he did is a fairly serious criminal offence.

If this was 90s then as I remember there were not yet standards to deal with this kind of problem. Actually, thinking about this now, I don't even remember they existed this type of software in 90s but I might be mistaken.

It definitely existed in some form by the late 90's. I recall very basic surveillance and remote control software being installed on school machines back then.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#103
My recommendation:

A) Audit your base machine for any suspicious processes. Most of the time, something will stick out. For Windows boxes, pay attention to the Startup/Autorun sections of the Windows Registry/Group Policy. On *Nix boxes, either unit or init scripts; audit your launched plists.

B) If you do suspect information exfiltration/monitoring; cripple/subvert the sensors/information stream. Exact details will vary depending on the nature of the spyware. A hardware bug is harder to do deal with than a software one, and some forms of software bugging are more difficult to circumvent than others.

C) If it is really overt and obnoxious; organize with coworkers. The only thing that'll eventually get the message across to unscrupulous and invasive employers is collective organized resistance. One or two or up to 100 depending on size they may not give a damn, but when half the workforce is up in arms, there will have to be a carefully considered response.

D) Always be ready to leave. Seriously. Particularly in today's day and age. I don't think it's natural at first, as we all at some level I think hope that our employer has some intrinsic loyalty toward us as an employee; but that really isn't the case at all culturally anymore. Don't let it hold you back from doing your best, but always keep in mind they are making more off you than you them; otherwise it isn't a business that's going to be staying around for very long.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#104
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's standard practice if you agree to it in your employment contract.

Yes but would it always hold up in court? You can give your soul away by installing a piece of software without reading the agreement but it wouldn't hold water, of course. Curious how this would work with federal or state level wiretap laws.

It's your employer's hardware. It's legal for companies to oversee the work their employees are doing.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think less than 5% of comments on open-office design, that I have ever seen, were positive. It's basically taboo to say anything positive about open office spaces online. There are many, many legitimately terrible open office workspaces in the world. Suggesting that open offices aren't always bad feels like an attack on those who are miserable in their open office. So it's safer to just never bring it up. In the…

I actually enjoy open office plans despite not liking group work/study. I prefer being alone. I don't really see people other than my wife outside of work. Work is my only chance to socialize, which makes an open office plan ideal for me. It's very easy to start conversations with the people near me and have them turn into fun group discussions. Once you give up on the idea of having long unbroken periods of producti…

If I gave up on those I would find another career. They are the whole point. Flow is 100% of what I like about software engineering.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#106
post #6

This happened to me years ago. I was put in an empty office at the opposite end from my boss, and because he couldn't walk up behind me to see me working, he secretly installed a program on my computer that took a screenshot every 30 seconds (or so?). I quickly noticed that my computer was hitching regularly (when the screenshot was taken - this was in the late 90s BTW), and so investigated my computer on a day when…

> because he couldn't walk up behind me to see me working, he secretly installed a program on my computer that took a screenshot every 30 seconds

> The irony was that I was probably the most productive person in that office (in my humble opinion).

The easiest and the most efficient way to ruin my productivity is to look at my screen. I can't work (nor can I pee - a funny coincidence, that's called "paruresis") when somebody is watching.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think less than 5% of comments on open-office design, that I have ever seen, were positive. Who are the people you are describing as being “sold”?

> I think less than 5% of comments on open-office design, that I have ever seen, were positive. It's basically taboo to say anything positive about open office spaces online. There are many, many legitimately terrible open office workspaces in the world. Suggesting that open offices aren't always bad feels like an attack on those who are miserable in their open office. So it's safer to just never bring it up. In the…

This comment is spot on. The few times I brought up open offices (which I don't like) with my coworkers, most of them favored them. They liked being able to easily have a brief chat with someone, and generally having a more social feel to the office. They worried that in an environment with private offices, it would be harder to interrupt someone with a question, and that collaboration would suffer as a result. I feel like I almost never read this perspective on Hacker News, but it's very common in the real world.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#108
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if the employee is informed upfront. Otherwise it's a privacy issue.

There's an expectation of privacy on company owned hardware?

In the EU there is. For instance the company can't normally access directories or emails clearly labelled as "private". Monitoring can occur but it's pretty tightly regulated.

See for instance https://gdpr.report/news/2017/11/17/5383/

> * Employers can monitor employees’ emails at work but need to approach this with caution and careful consideration.

> * Follow the ICO Code and 29 WP opinion, including conducting a DPIA prior to undertaking any monitoring, considering whether it is possible to achieve the objective through less instructive means and ensuring policies clearly notify employees that monitoring takes place, why and that the content of emails may be viewed.

> * If emails are identified as or are clearly “personal” do not open unless there is a real risk of serious harm to the business and, where possible, inform the employee in advance that the content may be viewed.

I find that perfectly reasonable IMO. You're not your company's property. Your boss can't put a camera in the corporate bathroom's stall just because he owns it.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#109
Where I work there is less focus on micromanaging people's time and more focus on results. Having your activity micromanaged at that level is mentally exhausting. When I was in college and had no skills whatsoever I used to do Lionbridge/Leapforce which had you do all kinds of stuff like rank search results, check videos for nudity, etc. They had an extension that would monitor all your activity and if you stopped and got distracted it would impact your rating/health and you could eventually be fired (not sure if firing is the right word its a gig type thing). IMO this is very nerve wracking and not mentally healthy for workers to experience. Treat people like adults and on average they will act like adults. You will always have underperformers regardless of whether you are micromanaging their time or not. Sometimes I want to take a break to play with my dog or decompress after a long meeting. Everyone should have the same right to do so. Ironically, archaic notions about micromanaging workers time works against employers more than working for them.

Re: Bosses panic-buy spy software to keep tabs on remote workers

#110
post #66

Mark Cuban got it right last week when he said that the way companies treat their employees over the next few months will define their brand for the next several decades. Companies insisting on this level of control are simply adding cost now and making employee retention difficult for when we end up coming out of this. If your company can't handle ground-level employees having some autonomy in their work, then your…

> If your company can't handle ground-level employees having some autonomy in their work, then your business model isn't likely to survive. > Besides, given the extraordinary circumstances I don't think it's fair to expect everyone to be equally productive to being in the office. It's worth noting that you're describing a very specific subset of the world of employment, namely people who work with some degree of auto…

I would be shocked if even half of the American workforce primarily works in an "at a desk" or equivalent type position.

I'm curious about this but don't have time to look up numbers. It's hard to make a reasonable guess because while cities (and the offices within them) have the highest density, there could be a very long tail of factory, strip mall, grocery store, etc. jobs that would be higher per capita outside of cities and invisible to someone living inside a city.

Post reply on HN