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Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

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Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#211

Post by JohnTHaller »

strictnein wrote: post #61
vkou wrote: post #20

My only question is: "Why hasn't the world done this two weeks ago?" The US is failing to test on a massive scale, and the outbreak has been growing exponentially, week after week. Control measures are being taken, but on an inconsistent, fragmented basis.

The US is currently testing ~100k people each day: https://covidtracking.com/us-daily/ The failure at the beginning was not to have capacity ready. The huge US medical system and its very, very large medical industry has finally gotten pointed in the right direction in regards to testing.

It's way too late for widespread testing to stop the initial big spread. We missed that window thanks to lapses in leadership, technical mistakes, and bureaucratic nonsense. Statisticians and doctors estimate that 600,000 to 1,200,000 are already infected.

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#212

Post by mschuster91 »

roenxi wrote: post #41
mschuster91 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that long lasting, at least for country/continental blocks. As soon as vaccines are widely available, I'd expect that the only thing that remains from the corona crisis is a visa/immigration requirement of proof of vaccination/immunity.

A basic rule-of-thumb is this is a 1 in 100 year event; because the last time something comparable happened was the Spanish Flu. However, a hypothesis that international travel is the major enabler reduces this to more of a 1 in 20 year event (SARS, MERS, Ebola, etc, etc all were near misses that were a little less slippery). Swine flu was also pretty bad. We might be able to afford this once a century. We can't affo…

I'd say it makes more sense to lift poor countries/regions out of poverty and introduce basic sanitation/hygiene standards as well as to reduce mass animal farming and antibiotic/antiviral usage there.

Prevent stuff going bad at the root cause rather than trying to limit its effects.

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#213

Post by CivBase »

pmachinery wrote: post #125
CivBase wrote: post #79

Okay... but why specifically the United States? Shouldn't they ban entry from just about every nation right now? Did the article just fail to mention existing travel bans for other nations? The US has a very high number of confirmed cases, but it still pales in comparison to many other nations in terms of percent of population. Banning international travel is a reasonable precaution, but why specifically the US? I ca…

> but why specifically the United States? [...] but why specifically the US? Possibly because, as it says in the second line of the article, the US now has the highest number of confirmed cases (more than 124,000 currently, from around 660,000 confirmed worldwide).

I addressed that.

> The US has a very high number of confirmed cases, but it still pales in comparison to many other nations in terms of percent of population.

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#214

Post by CivBase »

dannyr wrote: post #135
CivBase wrote: post #79

Okay... but why specifically the United States? Shouldn't they ban entry from just about every nation right now? Did the article just fail to mention existing travel bans for other nations? The US has a very high number of confirmed cases, but it still pales in comparison to many other nations in terms of percent of population. Banning international travel is a reasonable precaution, but why specifically the US? I ca…

From https://www.nytimes.com/article/coronavirus-travel-restricti... As of March 15, Japan has banned entry to foreign travelers with Chinese passports issued by Hubei and Zhejiang provinces, as well as those who have visited regions in China that have been affected by the virus, South Korea, Iran or Italy within the last 14 days. On March 18, Japan added two provinces of Switzerland, four states in Spain and the ent…

Thanks. I wish the article provided that context.

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#215

Post by rsynnott »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #170
rsynnott wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some countries have said they’ll re-evaluate around the middle of April. Generally in the sense of potentially easing very strict lockdowns of the ‘“don’t go outside your house except to the supermarket unless you’re essential personnel” variety. Nowhere else but the US is claiming that as an end date, as far as I know.

Every national government I'm aware of has officially set a hard end date for their lockdown measures, even if they're unofficially pretty sure things will be extended. Even Italy and Spain.

So from a legal point of view, in democratic countries, it would not be feasible or wise to say “you’re shut down indefinitely”. The normal practice is to say “til date X, but restrictions will remain beyond that and we might extend”. Nowhere but the US is anyone promising an end date (and even there it’s just the wacky clown-President; in practice the civil service is implicitly contradicting him).

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#216

Post by icebraining »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #170
rsynnott wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some countries have said they’ll re-evaluate around the middle of April. Generally in the sense of potentially easing very strict lockdowns of the ‘“don’t go outside your house except to the supermarket unless you’re essential personnel” variety. Nowhere else but the US is claiming that as an end date, as far as I know.

Every national government I'm aware of has officially set a hard end date for their lockdown measures, even if they're unofficially pretty sure things will be extended. Even Italy and Spain.

Not an end to the lockdown, just the end of the validity of the current State of Emergency declaration, which can then be renewed.

Here in Portugal, they've already stated the lockdown will remain in effect at least until the end of May, and haven't given any hard end dates.

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#217

Post by axolttl88 »

cyphar wrote: post #138
adele11 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Australia is now requiring a 2 week hotel isolation

Except the hotel is in the middle of the city, and there are other non-quarantined residents living in the same hotel who are almost certainly going to get sick. I think the correct solution is what Vietnam has done -- convert military barracks into a quarantine centers so that suspected cases cannot infect the general public. This is also much better than the self-isolation policy that they had until a few days ago…

Australian here: It’s not a given that the other hotel residents are going to get sick.

The quarantine residents are bussed in directly from customs / border control and isolated to separate parts of the hotel.

Their rooms are locked down (they don’t get the key), they don’t get in room cleaning (they can get their laundry and fresh supplies dropped off / picked up in a controlled way from outside the room periodically), and they get room service delivered / picked up outside the room. Staff have/are being trained in performing those duties.

All paid for by the government, too. It’s not ideal for anyone, but for the community at large it’s the best possible policy given how many new infections were coming from inbound travellers.

It also works well for the hotels which have very high vacancy rates due to lack of tourists.

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#218

Post by cyphar »

axolttl88 wrote: post #217
cyphar wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the hotel is in the middle of the city, and there are other non-quarantined residents living in the same hotel who are almost certainly going to get sick. I think the correct solution is what Vietnam has done -- convert military barracks into a quarantine centers so that suspected cases cannot infect the general public. This is also much better than the self-isolation policy that they had until a few days ago…

Australian here: It’s not a given that the other hotel residents are going to get sick. The quarantine residents are bussed in directly from customs / border control and isolated to separate parts of the hotel. Their rooms are locked down (they don’t get the key), they don’t get in room cleaning (they can get their laundry and fresh supplies dropped off / picked up in a controlled way from outside the room periodical…

I'm also Australian. I was referring to the previous decision to put everyone from the Norwegian Jewel into the Swissotel right in the middle of the Sydney CBD[1]. The brand-new policy you're referring to was announced only slightly before I posted my original comment (I wasn't aware of the change at the time and thus wasn't referring to it).

[1]: https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/health/health-problems/cor...

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#219

Post by brigandish »

verroq wrote: post #207
brigandish wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going by what is known now , or else how would I ever be able to comment on anything?

The whole point is to prep for the future, if you target the present you’re always going to be one step behind.

This isn't a student debate on epistemology, but if it were I'd begin by asking how you prep for the future without knowledge of the present situation.

As it isn't a student debate on epistemology I think we can leave this conversation here.

Re: Japan set to ban entry from the U.S. as early as next week

#220

Post by seanmcdirmid »

chrischen wrote: post #204
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese medicine has a lot of costs for little if any benefits. Disease from live animals is just one of them, but then their is the medical resources wasted on not really cures, hospital profiteering, and not to mention causing entire species to become endangered or even extinct. Peer review and control study the stuff that works and call it normal medicine, the rest of the folk cures might as well be homeopathy. Bl…

I did some research on bats vs pangolins. It seems that pangolins are illegal in China and sometimes used for medicine (though I'm not sure if consuming them raw is a part of it). I think the practice of illegal animal trading of pangolins is a separate issue altogether from just consuming non beef/pork/chicken food that we're used to. However from what I can tell the consumption of bats, while uncommon, is just as a…

> hinese medicine is also practiced in Taiwan, and while the system differs from the West, it's based on tradition. If you believe in evolution, then you should believe that in general only methodologies that have some effect would survive over time. That's the basis of traditional medicine at least, and just because it's not quantified and understood in the Western way does not mean it is all fake.

This is a very anti science way of looking at the world. The west has pseudoscience also: homeopathy and faith-based healing, crystals, witch craft, etc...

I don’t believe in evolution: I believe in the strong evidence that supports the theory of evolution. Lots of things have stood the test of time that are complete bunk with no supporting evidence what so ever, eg all religions. China can’t afford to push pseudosciences, neither can the USA, it does more harm than good.

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