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Huawei is dividing Western nations

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Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#61

Post by matsemann »

NicoJuicy wrote: post #45
nimbius wrote: post #22

>...the goal of American policy on Huawei is less about security and more about market share – and making sure America, not China, owns the future of 5G. Bingo. Most HN readers saw this for exactly what it was. Most of the premise for the arrest of Meng Wanzhou was comical at best. 30 years of US companies ignoring ITAR with at most a small fine, only to suddenly watch the US issue an extradition warrant for a chines…

The average reader of HN would rather have their data shared with the US, then with China. Not many good things have come out of China privacy related. It's against what a lot of readers here value in our "digital Life". Who here truelly believes the "0" Covid case numbers that China is publishing? :)

> The average reader of HN would rather have their data shared with the US, then with China.

Why is that? If anything I'm a bit at the opposite. Prism, cambridge analytica and the likes means that my western data is actively being used against me, by our own governments etc. It may be naive but it almost feels safer having my data in hands not cooperating with western intelligence...

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#62

Post by londons_explore »

zobzu wrote: post #49
nimbius wrote: post #22

>...the goal of American policy on Huawei is less about security and more about market share – and making sure America, not China, owns the future of 5G. Bingo. Most HN readers saw this for exactly what it was. Most of the premise for the arrest of Meng Wanzhou was comical at best. 30 years of US companies ignoring ITAR with at most a small fine, only to suddenly watch the US issue an extradition warrant for a chines…

My personal take is: Huawei belongs to CCP. Korean and US companies do not belong to their governments. This should be an issue by default, in my opinion. That said it's not why I distrust Huawei (not that I trust Google, Cisco, Qualcomm all that much more - but I give them more benefit of the doubt). I don't even care about ATT because if you trust your carrier you're already toast, and I do not know any carrier tha…

> US companies do not belong to their governments.

Did you see the news last week that GM is being forced to switch manufacturing to produce ventilators...

Not paid to do it... Forced to... When that kind of thing happens, it's clear there isn't a separation line between company management and their governments.

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#63

Post by echelon »

murderfs wrote: post #38
echelon wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think you're being generous to the administration for assigning blame to China. I pay the administration no mind whatsoever. The way this has been handed by Trump is beyond incompetent. Placing the blame on China is an opinion I reached entirely on my own while the president was still out golfing. I'm speaking out because I want our leadership to take action. I'll be asking my representatives to stick China with…

> China had an obligation to its citizens and to the world. The CCP decided they didn't care if the virus went worldwide. That's homicide, and they should pay for making people whole again. I'm no fan of the CCP, but this is ridiculous. In your hypothetical world where China takes action to prevent this, what would they have done? The common reaction from public health professionals to the Hubei lockdown was that it…

> In your hypothetical world where China takes action to prevent this, what would they have done?

Why did they ask for international travel to remain open while simultaneously limiting internal travel?

Why did they threaten to stop shipments of the medicines they manufacture?

Why did they silence the whistleblowers?

Why are they telling their people the virus originated from the US and Italy?

Why did they decline aid or let other health organizations put boots on the ground to measure things?

Why are they strong-arming the WHO? And why did it take so long for the WHO to declare this as a pandemic?

Why are there more cremated remains than their official death toll?

I'm not imagining anything. I'm looking at their actions.

> Are you saying that it's reasonable to expect them to have done more, sooner?

Yes.

They had a better understanding of the virus than the rest of the world and they owed us complete transparency.

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#64

Post by blackrock »

shasheene wrote: post #19

Huawei is in large part built upon technology stolen from Cisco and Canada's Nortel Networks. In the latter case, there is strong evidence China was able to maintain access to Nortel's internal networks for over a decade (!!) which helped kill the 117 year old company. [1] The government of China is systematically hacking corporations through the Ministry of State Security, and attempting to the switch the allegiance…

This was already known. They settled this already. So Huawei already paid up for their malfeasance to break into a new market.

However, does any of their new 5G technology come from Cisco or Nortel? Or any other American company?

Did they also steal this 5G technology from Cisco?

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#65

Post by saiya-jin »

NicoJuicy wrote: post #45
nimbius wrote: post #22

>...the goal of American policy on Huawei is less about security and more about market share – and making sure America, not China, owns the future of 5G. Bingo. Most HN readers saw this for exactly what it was. Most of the premise for the arrest of Meng Wanzhou was comical at best. 30 years of US companies ignoring ITAR with at most a small fine, only to suddenly watch the US issue an extradition warrant for a chines…

The average reader of HN would rather have their data shared with the US, then with China. Not many good things have come out of China privacy related. It's against what a lot of readers here value in our "digital Life". Who here truelly believes the "0" Covid case numbers that China is publishing? :)

Well, no. I agree that average HN reader comes from US, hence your statement is technically valid, but thats about it.

I am so fucking fed up with US abusing its power, being a world bully #1 and overall a force of evil in quite a few aspects that actually matter.

Yes, China has a bad track record. So does US these days. China didn't literally kill millions of civilians half around the world that didn't harm anybody, in their homes, for terrorist attack on US soil done by Saudis with good US political connections. China didn't help to create ISIS by creating massive power vacuum in middle east. In fact, China isn't fucking the whole world by continuously making whole middle east utterly unstable for another at least 100 years with their idiotic foreign policies. I could go on ranting like this for a long time.

Maybe average US person doesn't care. Rest of the world, ie 95% of mankind, does.

I say US needs some counter-balance, it grew too arrogant. You know, some proper competition to bring again the best of your once great country.

For now, whether China or US has my data is same to me. No in fact I am more OK with China now, less real impact (which might change obviously)

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#66

Post by bildung »

zobzu wrote: post #49
nimbius wrote: post #22

>...the goal of American policy on Huawei is less about security and more about market share – and making sure America, not China, owns the future of 5G. Bingo. Most HN readers saw this for exactly what it was. Most of the premise for the arrest of Meng Wanzhou was comical at best. 30 years of US companies ignoring ITAR with at most a small fine, only to suddenly watch the US issue an extradition warrant for a chines…

My personal take is: Huawei belongs to CCP. Korean and US companies do not belong to their governments. This should be an issue by default, in my opinion. That said it's not why I distrust Huawei (not that I trust Google, Cisco, Qualcomm all that much more - but I give them more benefit of the doubt). I don't even care about ATT because if you trust your carrier you're already toast, and I do not know any carrier tha…

What do you think about Ciscos security history? They have had literally hundreds of remote code execution vulnerabilities.

https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-16/C... (sort by severity, right now there are 450 flaws with severity 9.0 or more in the list)

I can't imagine that it is only incompetence that makes them implement new remote backdoors on an almost monthly basis.

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#67

Post by joaomacp »

londons_explore wrote: post #62
zobzu wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My personal take is: Huawei belongs to CCP. Korean and US companies do not belong to their governments. This should be an issue by default, in my opinion. That said it's not why I distrust Huawei (not that I trust Google, Cisco, Qualcomm all that much more - but I give them more benefit of the doubt). I don't even care about ATT because if you trust your carrier you're already toast, and I do not know any carrier tha…

> US companies do not belong to their governments. Did you see the news last week that GM is being forced to switch manufacturing to produce ventilators... Not paid to do it... Forced to... When that kind of thing happens, it's clear there isn't a separation line between company management and their governments.

You are overgeneralizing: the US did this in a crisis. China has been doing this frequently. It's not valid to equate them.

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#68

Post by manquer »

eklavya wrote: post #29
thre234324 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Americans might think of East Asians as their slaves, but experience has showed that even the vassals of the US are generally not as hard as the Americans/Europeans would like. This is but a reprisal of the old colonizers running around wrecking Asia to their will; I wonder if India will serve its old role of being the mercenary for destroying Asia again.

Hmm, what have we Indians ever destroyed?

Perhaps he is alluding to India’s involvement in the opium trade during the 19th century ?

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#69

Post by icebraining »

redis_mlc wrote: post #33
millstone wrote: post #15

How is it that the west allowed Huawei to gain such a lead in 5G? If this has national security implications, why didn't the US support its domestic telecom firms?

The US, outside of the military, has a failure to make policy, whereas China has very clear development policies. Why is that? The US is led mainly by lawyers, where facts are debatable, whereas most of China's leaders are STEM graduates. Thus China has constructed around 50 new cities and airports in the past couple of decades, while the US literally can't dig a tunnel from one side of Central Expressway in Mountain…

We've had a couple of engineers as PMs in my Southern EU country (one of them is now the Secretary General of the UN - he started his career as an assistant professor teaching systems theory and telecommunications signals), and I can assure you it's no panacea. Pouring concrete is easy and not by itself synonymous with good governance.

And since you said "any other public policy", I have to say I'd easily trade 50 tunnels and airports for access to Wikipedia.

Re: Huawei is dividing Western nations

#70

Post by rumanator »

yurlungur wrote: post #59
rumanator wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I for one am surprised that anyone who is aware of some of the actions perpetrated by China's ruling regime with regards to their handling of the covid19 outbreak feels that they don't warant any criticism, and tried to pin any criticism on conspiracy theories involving troll farms and beating war drums.

Of course one can and should assign blame where it is due to the CCP. But demanding vengeful reparations from the whole country is pretty much a precursor to war. I can totally imagine a few leaders riling up public emotions this way and also conveniently directing all responsibilities outwards. I really hope the world doesn't repeat the history of the last century like that.

> Of course one can and should assign blame where it is due to the CCP. But demanding vengeful reparations from the whole country is pretty much a precursor to war.

No, it's the basis of any civil suit.

For some reason, you're trying desperately to spin holding an entity responsible for their actions as being akin to an act of war.

You're talking about the regime that simultaneously refuses to include positive and asymptomatic cases in their contagion statistics, and at the same time publish press releases announcing that the only new cases of coronsvirus infections within China come from infected foreigners.

States and governments are held accountable to their actions and inactions quite frequently, even I'm courts of law. Somehow you see China's regime immune and exempt from any responsibility of their actions. Why?

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