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From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

bloomberg.com

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Re: From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

#21

Post by Zenst »

411111111111111 wrote: post #8

Nobody forced the farmers to become reliant on migrant workers though. It was just a simple decision for them: cheap labor that's available today or expensive labor... They mostly went with cheap, and now they don't have anyone available. Tough luck I guess, but it always was just a question of time until this happened.

> Nobody forced the farmers to become reliant on migrant workers though.

Not strictly true in a competative market that races for the lowest possible cost. It's the toxic company culture mentality that in this case, the shareholders are the customers and they want to have their cheap food.

Hence many farmers been squeezed via large corporations and dairy farmers and many others operate upon margins that are just insane and unsustainable that many end up producing at a loss overall.

Re: From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

#23

Post by peterwoerner »

411111111111111 wrote: post #8

Nobody forced the farmers to become reliant on migrant workers though. It was just a simple decision for them: cheap labor that's available today or expensive labor... They mostly went with cheap, and now they don't have anyone available. Tough luck I guess, but it always was just a question of time until this happened.

I mean, the market does. Most people won't pay an 50% on food because the farmers pay a living wage.

Re: From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

#25

Post by makomk »

groby_b wrote: post #9
Zenst wrote: post #2

Hopefully this may incentivize people to be a bit more self-sufficient. Gardens that you grow your own, allotments - the mentality of that has been driven away over decades and now people are starting to smell the roses and realize they can't eat them. So in many avenues - complacency gets highlighted more and I'm sure many and much will change on the back of this period in time. Overall I'd say for the better. Certa…

This is a very naive take on the world. You'll need at the very least half an acre to feed yourself sustainably, and that's if you're highly optimized. It's also backbreaking work, and you won't be able to do much else except subsistence farming. In short, it's not practical for the vast majority of the population. The closest we can probably get to this model is instead CSA memberships, supporting farms right outsid…

Note that it's fine to leave the supply of staples like wheat to large farmers with economies of scale, since that's heavily mechanized and doesn't require many workers, plus the workers it does rely on can be fairly effectively distanced. It's mostly the stuff like fresh fruit and vegetables which is the problem. Those are less reliant on economies of scale and more on cheap imported labour.

Re: From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

#26

Post by llampx »

partingshots wrote: post #4

Doesn’t the Netherlands export the majority of Europe’s fresh food? As long as the supply chain doesn’t break down, I don’t see how it would be possible for Spain and Germany to run out of food. Especially since they’re all in the EU, even if the Netherlands wanted to close off their borders, there’s no way they really could.

I'm not sure what you mean by countries in the EU not being able to close their borders, they can.

Re: From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

#27

Post by Zenst »

pascalxus wrote: post #17
Zenst wrote: post #2

Hopefully this may incentivize people to be a bit more self-sufficient. Gardens that you grow your own, allotments - the mentality of that has been driven away over decades and now people are starting to smell the roses and realize they can't eat them. So in many avenues - complacency gets highlighted more and I'm sure many and much will change on the back of this period in time. Overall I'd say for the better. Certa…

It's sad, but here in CA, most people don't have yards and there's nowhere to grow food. It's especially dumb because there's miles and miles of undeveloped land everywhere (at least in the east bay suberbs), not being used for anything in particular except maybe some farms with cows on it: I'm sure they're taking advantage of huge tax wholes because they're sitting on land that would cost 10s of millions of dollars…

I live in a flat, it has windows and window ledges and I grow things - sure not enough to sustain, but makes a dent in the right direction, also helps flats air quality.

As for compost, i'm supprised as I live in London and can easily get it. But appreciate that it may be a case of supply/demand and if no demand, the supply moves away.

Seems like an opportunity business wise in the times ahead as if you have that issue - many others will.

Re: From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

#29

Post by war1025 »

alexandernst wrote: post #5
Zenst wrote: post #2

Hopefully this may incentivize people to be a bit more self-sufficient. Gardens that you grow your own, allotments - the mentality of that has been driven away over decades and now people are starting to smell the roses and realize they can't eat them. So in many avenues - complacency gets highlighted more and I'm sure many and much will change on the back of this period in time. Overall I'd say for the better. Certa…

Where (physically) do you expect 500.000 (a small town example) people garden their own food? They'd need to travel outside town, garden, then get back (and all this while also commuting to work on a daily basis). Also, the amount of tools every single person would need to buy. "Decentralisation" is a goof idea, but not feasible in the real world, IMHO. And this is a small town example, leave alone a huge capital lik…

Did you honestly just call half a million people a small town? That is a major metro in many parts of the world.

Re: From Spain to Germany, farmers warn of fresh food shortages

#30

Post by Zenst »

groby_b wrote: post #9
Zenst wrote: post #2

Hopefully this may incentivize people to be a bit more self-sufficient. Gardens that you grow your own, allotments - the mentality of that has been driven away over decades and now people are starting to smell the roses and realize they can't eat them. So in many avenues - complacency gets highlighted more and I'm sure many and much will change on the back of this period in time. Overall I'd say for the better. Certa…

This is a very naive take on the world. You'll need at the very least half an acre to feed yourself sustainably, and that's if you're highly optimized. It's also backbreaking work, and you won't be able to do much else except subsistence farming. In short, it's not practical for the vast majority of the population. The closest we can probably get to this model is instead CSA memberships, supporting farms right outsid…

OK, i'm not saying we all grow all our own food, but certainly a little helps and a step in the right direction and you can bet many will avenue that and what they can in the times ahead now.

Certainly growing your own herbs in a flat very sustainable.

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