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The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

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Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#31

Post by gnachman »

pier25 wrote: post #29

> given that Mac apps are less complex to write than iOS apps these days Do you agree HN?

I write both: iOS during the day and macOS at night. iOS is significantly less buggy and has less legacy baggage than macOS. iOS has some features that macOS doesn't, so there is more to learn. I spend a lot less time working around platform brokenness on iOS than on macOS. macOS lets you do a lot more than iOS in ways that are unmaintainable (e.g., private APIs), which helps you create accidental complexity for yourself.

Both platforms have a long tail of little-known behaviors (such as accessibility features) that make it hard to create well behaved applications. But iOS mostly just works (once you know which features are toxic and avoid them), while macOS's brokenness has completely metastasized.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#32

Post by ksec »

obarthelemy wrote: post #19

Actually, when Apple launched the Airbuds, I computed that it was very likely the AirBuds would generate more profit for Apple than Mac hardware. IIRC assuming 70% profit on the Airbuds and 30% on the Mac (because lots more R&D, lots more support, lots more warranty, lots more dev...), a 30% attach rate made the Airbuds more profitable.

Um, what has this got to do with this article?

Let's just assume AirPods did make 3x more Net profits than Mac.

AirPod ASP is roughly ~$169, Mac ASP is roughly ~$1300, AirPods would still need to sell roughly 2.6 times more for it to be more profitable than Mac. That is 46M to 50M AirPod per year.

Even the most optimistic estimate of AirPod sales fall far below that number.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#33

Post by hellofunk »

gnachman wrote: post #31
pier25 wrote: post #29

> given that Mac apps are less complex to write than iOS apps these days Do you agree HN?

I write both: iOS during the day and macOS at night. iOS is significantly less buggy and has less legacy baggage than macOS. iOS has some features that macOS doesn't, so there is more to learn. I spend a lot less time working around platform brokenness on iOS than on macOS. macOS lets you do a lot more than iOS in ways that are unmaintainable (e.g., private APIs), which helps you create accidental complexity for your…

I’m curious which features you would advise a dev to avoid in iOS, because their problems, i.e. toxicity. I’m getting more into iOS programming and it would be great to know some pitfalls on the roadmap.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#34

Post by coliveira »

Klonoar wrote: post #16
anoncareer0212 wrote: post #3

Apple fan/dev here: he's an old school Mac influencer who got famous for writing the first popular Mac RSS client, and blind to the effects his particular narrative would have on those numbers - it's the same 30,000 people who are hip to Mac blog culture, not independent discovery on two separate platforms

Ah, yes, the same crowd that wonders why people won't write native Mac Apps but then rarely acknowledges the documentation is utterly lacking in significant places. I say this as someone who writes those apps.

Not only documentation is lacking, but Apple has the annoying tendency to change their frameworks every few years. Writing a MacOS app is a fight against the constant changes.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#36

Post by freehunter »

pvg wrote: post #28
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like being on Hacker News sometimes warps the context of a personal blog post. If I put out a tweet that said "Huh, my app got about the same number of downloads on iOS and Mac, I think the market's about the same for certain types of apps" would you say my tweet is full of vagaries and incorrect assumptions?

sometimes warps the context of a personal blog post That's true but those blog posts end up making poor HN posts. This one is very short, contains a little bit of data and would not have been hn-noticed other than for the deliberately provocative title which then becomes the central topic of the HN discussion. People familiar with the author/blog don't have any trouble recognizing their chain is being playfully tugge…

I’ve had my personal blog be linked on HN without my knowledge and the comments damn near made me stop writing altogether. Everyone assumed I wrote the post for them to read it, when in reality I just wrote it for myself and someone else submitted it.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#37

Post by cac1 »

pier25 wrote: post #29

> given that Mac apps are less complex to write than iOS apps these days Do you agree HN?

No I don't agree. I have written both. Based on that I think the issue of which is easier to program depends more of the complexity of the app than on the platform. I will admit there are times that macOS feels more like a hell-hole of a poorly though out or incomplete programming environment.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#38

Post by sdegutis »

coliveira wrote: post #34
Klonoar wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, yes, the same crowd that wonders why people won't write native Mac Apps but then rarely acknowledges the documentation is utterly lacking in significant places. I say this as someone who writes those apps.

Not only documentation is lacking, but Apple has the annoying tendency to change their frameworks every few years. Writing a MacOS app is a fight against the constant changes.

Plus the experience of Electron apps is generally superior lately. Look and feel may not be as consistent as the ideal but it generally never was in the first place, even among native Cocoa apps. The web has won on desktop.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#39

Post by jolux »

oefrha wrote: post #5
crabl wrote: post #2

I don't know about that... I think the only conclusion you could draw from this might be that the market for iOS and Mac _RSS readers_ are almost the same size. You might even be able to stretch it to say they are the _same_ market.

I wouldn’t even draw that conclusion. NetNewsWire is very old school with an old fan base, and outside its existing fan base I don’t think it’s particularly relevant today (sorry). I doubt a user new to RSS or new to RSS reader on Apple platforms today would land on NNW. (I’m a longtime Reeder user.)

The new NNW is a total rewrite which started off as a different app.

Re: The iOS and Mac markets are almost the same size?

#40

Post by Wowfunhappy »

sdegutis wrote: post #38
coliveira wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only documentation is lacking, but Apple has the annoying tendency to change their frameworks every few years. Writing a MacOS app is a fight against the constant changes.

Plus the experience of Electron apps is generally superior lately. Look and feel may not be as consistent as the ideal but it generally never was in the first place, even among native Cocoa apps. The web has won on desktop.

> Plus the experience of Electron apps is generally superior lately

Uh, I'm going to hard disagree on that. They take longer to open, they're slower to use, they take up more battery, and they don't behave in a consistent way with the rest of the OS.

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