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Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

mandarinmansion.com

11–20 of 31 posts

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curved swords are quite common in Persian, Indian, Chinese, and Japanese cultures. They're not exclusively Chinese.

I guess the OP meant this hook sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword It does have a strange shape, and indeed I don't think I saw anything similar in other cultures.

This is more of an axe than a sword.

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curved swords are quite common in Persian, Indian, Chinese, and Japanese cultures. They're not exclusively Chinese.

I guess the OP meant this hook sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword It does have a strange shape, and indeed I don't think I saw anything similar in other cultures.

oh..

Well, here's a kinda similar European version

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_(weapon)

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#13
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curved swords are quite common in Persian, Indian, Chinese, and Japanese cultures. They're not exclusively Chinese.

Even the Europeans used curved swords: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabre Generally curved swords are better at slashing and straight swords better at thrusting, which is particularly useful against weak points in armors.

OP is talking about these

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#15
What was expected to become a quick and decisive victory for the otherwise highly effective Qing army, ended in a stalemate.

This was a constant theme throughout Chinese dynastic history -- leaders at the provincial or national level underestimating the military capabilities of tribal peoples/"barbarians," rebels, and smaller tributary states. The preceding Ming dynasty is littered with similar examples involving Japanese-led pirate bands on the coast and tribal groups to the north and west. The 15th-century Zhengtong Emperor decided to take part in crushing one border flare-up with the Mongols, and was even captured. The dynasty itself was ended by Manchu invaders in the mid-1600s.

I don't believe the Ming ever trained a distinct/elite group of special forces as described in TFA, but innovative and effective generals were sometimes given special commands and employed new modes of training and tactics but using regular conscripted forces. The aforementioned Japanese-led pirates raiding the coast were vanquished in this way.

I recommend 1587, A Year of No Significance: The Ming Dynasty in Decline by Ray Huang (a historian and former military officer) for anyone who is interested in this topic.

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#16
post #15

What was expected to become a quick and decisive victory for the otherwise highly effective Qing army, ended in a stalemate. This was a constant theme throughout Chinese dynastic history -- leaders at the provincial or national level underestimating the military capabilities of tribal peoples/"barbarians," rebels, and smaller tributary states. The preceding Ming dynasty is littered with similar examples involving Jap…

But that's not a problem unique to China. Historically people from stronger/wealthier nations have underestimated others in poorer nations, especially when the poorer country is on the defense. Mongols vs. Vietnam, UK vs. Maori, Japan vs. China (China took a beating but Japan thought they can win the war in 4 months and China's strategy did win out in the end at great cost.), Chinese nationalist vs. Chinese communists, France vs. Vietnam, US vs. Vietnam, China vs. Vietnam, USSR vs. Afghanistan, etc.

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess the OP meant this hook sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword It does have a strange shape, and indeed I don't think I saw anything similar in other cultures.

This is more of an axe than a sword.

Are you looking at it backwards? I think the axe looking part is a guard for the hands. See how it's held: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#18
post #15

What was expected to become a quick and decisive victory for the otherwise highly effective Qing army, ended in a stalemate. This was a constant theme throughout Chinese dynastic history -- leaders at the provincial or national level underestimating the military capabilities of tribal peoples/"barbarians," rebels, and smaller tributary states. The preceding Ming dynasty is littered with similar examples involving Jap…

But that's not a problem unique to China. Historically people from stronger/wealthier nations have underestimated others in poorer nations, especially when the poorer country is on the defense. Mongols vs. Vietnam, UK vs. Maori, Japan vs. China (China took a beating but Japan thought they can win the war in 4 months and China's strategy did win out in the end at great cost.), Chinese nationalist vs. Chinese communist…

Everyone else vs someone else in Afghanistan...

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#19

I always find certain weapons like the hook sword shown at the bottom to be interesting as they don't show up in other cultures, although the straight sword is pretty much available across the globe. Did it excel in some manner for the threats in China that were less relevant elsewhere? Maybe better armor in the west would have made it less relevant?

[deleted]

Re: Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty

#20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curved swords are quite common in Persian, Indian, Chinese, and Japanese cultures. They're not exclusively Chinese.

I guess the OP meant this hook sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword It does have a strange shape, and indeed I don't think I saw anything similar in other cultures.

This looks like a pre-Bat'leth.
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