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The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

nytimes.com

21–30 of 176 posts

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#21
post #19
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe the UK just ordered millions of antibody tests, that will tell you if you've previously had the virus. If we can confirm that people who previously had it are immune, we should be able to selectively let those back into normal society a lot faster. That's my understanding, I may be wrong.

Does the antibody test even exist yet? I was under the impression it doesn't.

They're due to arrive in weeks so I assume they do: https://www.cityam.com/millions-of-coronavirus-antibody-test...

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#22
post #3

I do not believe the US nor any of its states have made it a goal to stop the virus. Please give me links if this is wrong. Everything I have seen from government sources talks about "flatten the curve" or "slow the spread" or similar. The end result of any flatten the curve effort is 40-80% of the population is infected until the combination of herd immunity and social distancing stops the spread. Please can anyone…

Look up the press conference by Cuomo.

I’ve watched every one of Cuomo’s press conferences. He message is always clear - that we are trying to not overwhelm the health system.

He doesn’t say “flatten the curve” because he believes words matter and tries to communicate to avoid panic (Hence his refusal to call “Stay Indoors” as “Shelter in Place”)

But the medical side of the state government - along with their action - has been consistently flatten the curve.

No one but the highly delusional believes we can roll back community spread.

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#24
post #9
post #3

I do not believe the US nor any of its states have made it a goal to stop the virus. Please give me links if this is wrong. Everything I have seen from government sources talks about "flatten the curve" or "slow the spread" or similar. The end result of any flatten the curve effort is 40-80% of the population is infected until the combination of herd immunity and social distancing stops the spread. Please can anyone…

Just wait until the virus mutates. Then things will really be fun.

I don’t know why you were downvoted. Maybe because of the second sentence?

Mutation is a very real problem. After all flu goes through it all the time. That is the main reason why we get flu regularly. Second reason is that the immunity may be temporary.

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#25
post #3

I do not believe the US nor any of its states have made it a goal to stop the virus. Please give me links if this is wrong. Everything I have seen from government sources talks about "flatten the curve" or "slow the spread" or similar. The end result of any flatten the curve effort is 40-80% of the population is infected until the combination of herd immunity and social distancing stops the spread. Please can anyone…

There are two sides of this coin, that are sort of mutually exclusive:

1) On one hand, it's sort of a "competition" to gain "herd immunity". Of course if this is achievable, every country would want this, but not while disrupting civil society. So the measures makes sense for controllable scenarios, if introduction is managable.

2) COVID-19 is a completely new ("Novela") virus. We don't know long-term health impacts or long-term branches of mutation. Introduction to the masses is not without risks and costs. So if possible, stopping the virus would be preferable. There are uncountable potential viruses that are just waiting to be introduced as well, so an "open policy" doesn't necessarily make any sense. This shows how interconnected humans are today, that the "Me Only"-mantra is unsustainable, and that Capitalism crumbles in the face of real existential, uncertain adversity. This crisis is really minor.

UPDATE:

- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novel_virus

- https://www.newscientist.com/term/covid-19/

"The cause of the disease was soon confirmed as a new kind of coronavirus, and the infection has spread to a number of countries around the world."

There's no pre-existing immunity. All ages may require ICU and people without pre-existing conditions may get damages to their lungs.

In addition to handling known unknowns, states must also manage unknown unknowns.

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#26
post #8

There is no way to stop the virus in the US - 10 million undocumented immigrants in the US can not afford to sit at home and watch TV for 3 months, they can't help you to do your fancy contact tracing to expose their families and friends who are also undocumented. They can't afford to be tested or treated as none of them will be on the government hands out list. How could you stop the coronavirus when 10 million REAL…

I see you're being downvoted, but I don't sense any malice in your post. You're also not incorrect in your assessment, but your scope is a bit limited. There are far more than just undocumented immigrants who can't afford to stay home and will have to do whatever they can do to keep life going for themselves. This is true everywhere, not just the US.

The last to comply won't be holding out due to malice or ignorance, but necessity.

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#27

It feels like Europe and the US only have a few options: * Let the virus run its course and accept a huge death count. * Continue the lockdowns for months, strangling the economy. * Do what's in this article and allow life and the economy to return to normal. * Hope for a miracle. Am I missing something?

perhaps what you are missing is that even lesser measures could have massive impacts,

- do we need to take the temperature of everyone at each hour? almost certainly not. Should you be reporting in from every location? almost certainly not. Should we be treating each other as bioweapons all in the name of "safety"? absolutely not.

- is it good if mobility is reduced? almost certainly it has a massive effect.

I think the right course of action is to give all these measures some time to work. Let's stop adding yet another measure and keep making the ones that exist better.

Epidemiologists need to chill out a bit and stop treating a society as a mathematical model or molecules bouncing around in a container.

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#28
post #5

If there’s anything the current debacles in Europe and the U.S. has taught us, it’s that selfish and/or irrational jerks abound, and asking nicely doesn’t work at all.

This. I'm terrified by the number of utter idiots violating the restrictions and putting so many vulnerable people at risk. Or those people recorded while spreading their spit all over a train cart. Where is this coming from? What is those people's end game? It can't be due to stupidity; there must be some malice in this behaviour as well, right?

Some people just want to watch the world burn

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#29
post #8

There is no way to stop the virus in the US - 10 million undocumented immigrants in the US can not afford to sit at home and watch TV for 3 months, they can't help you to do your fancy contact tracing to expose their families and friends who are also undocumented. They can't afford to be tested or treated as none of them will be on the government hands out list. How could you stop the coronavirus when 10 million REAL…

Yes, during a global pandemic crisis like this, undocumented immigrants are the problem.

I bet every single one of those people in Disney World last week, partygoers in New Orleans, and spring break beach students were overwhelmingly not undocumented immigrants.

Fear mongering a disenfranchised population will get you nowhere.

Re: The Virus Can Be Stopped, but Only with Harsh Steps, Experts Say

#30
post #21
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does the antibody test even exist yet? I was under the impression it doesn't.

They're due to arrive in weeks so I assume they do: https://www.cityam.com/millions-of-coronavirus-antibody-test...

Well that's great news!
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