Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43 • Hacker News Board

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#11

Post by dangus » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:33 PM UTC

redis_mlc wrote: post #6

sumofi wrote: post #3

Not having health insurance is not an excuse. In Germany you are required by law to have it.

In the USA, acne and pregnancy are often disqualifying conditions. Services are often "out-of-network." So it doesn't matter if you pay the pemiums or not - you get massive surprise bills.

I agree that the US health system is beyond fucked up, but the statements in this comment are dramatization and not accurate on their own without a ton of qualifiers and clarifying statements.

“Out of network” doesn’t mean your health insurance plan doesn’t pay for anything. It usually just changes coinsurance rate. Anyone who has a major expensive hospital event while insured will just hit their maximum annual out of pocket amount and that coinsurance rate won’t matter. That’s not a good thing but it also means that this comment is misleading, implying that being out of network means that the insured person just has to foot the bill and that their insurance company dips out.

The whole point of the insurance network is that your health insurance company is encouraging you to take your routine doctor’s visits and scheduled non-emergency procedures to a place where they negotiate.

And acne and pregnancy aren’t disqualifying. What are you even saying they’re disqualified for? That’s a vast exaggeration.

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#12

Post by CPLX » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:33 PM UTC

Krokku wrote: post #8

You could buy 0.018 Tomahawk missiles for that or treat 54 people for every Tomahawk missile fired. All of the Tomahawk missiles fired since 2001 would have provided 119.000 people with free Corona treatment. I am thinking that countries with free healthcare care more about keeping their own people healthy than dropping missiles and misery on other countries people.

That math only makes sense if you take the medical industry’s insane pricing model as gospel.

If you had a straightforward nationally run healthcare system the math would be way more favorable still.

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#13

Post by vsareto » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:36 PM UTC

dangus wrote: post #9

sumofi wrote: post #3

Not having health insurance is not an excuse. In Germany you are required by law to have it.

This person is actually going to pay less than many people who are insured precisely because they’re uninsured. Someone who is insured in the US is not allowed to negotiate. This person can call the billing department and say “I can’t pay” and watch that bill plummet. The 50% or so of Americans who get their healthcare from solid employers will exhaust their deductible but otherwise be generally fine. Then there’s an…

>This person can call the billing department and say “I can’t pay” and watch that bill plummet.

I don't think it works this way that often. It might just get sent to a debt collector. They might give you a lower fee, but it won't be by that much.

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#14

Post by lidHanteyk » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:36 PM UTC

CPLX wrote: post #12

Krokku wrote: post #8

You could buy 0.018 Tomahawk missiles for that or treat 54 people for every Tomahawk missile fired. All of the Tomahawk missiles fired since 2001 would have provided 119.000 people with free Corona treatment. I am thinking that countries with free healthcare care more about keeping their own people healthy than dropping missiles and misery on other countries people.

That math only makes sense if you take the medical industry’s insane pricing model as gospel. If you had a straightforward nationally run healthcare system the math would be way more favorable still.

We know that a good rule of thumb in the USA is that health care costs are roughly twice what they ought to be. So just multiply by two: We could have treated around 238k people.

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#15

Post by NicoJuicy » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:36 PM UTC

tetromino_ wrote: post #4

sumofi wrote: post #3

Not having health insurance is not an excuse. In Germany you are required by law to have it.

In Germany, does your health insurance cost >$600 per month for 1 person if your employer or government doesn't subsidize it (for example, if you are self-employed and earning more than minimum wage from it)? Because that's the case in the US.

7,4 € per month for everyone ( Belgium)

https://www.cm.be/lid-worden/cm-bijdrage

Eg. Going to a doctor for a blood check costs 1€, 14€ is paid by the insurer

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#16

Post by alexhutcheson » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:36 PM UTC

The face values on medical bills in the US are like a bizarre joke - to a first approximation, no one ever pays them. Everyone with insurance gets insurer-negotiated "discounts" to around ~10% of the listed cost.

It's tougher for people without insurance - my understanding is that you can negotiate with the entity that sent you the bill to get significant reductions, but I don't have first-hand experience doing this. Even so, it sounds exhausting, since a single doctors visit will often result in bills from 2-3 separate entities (doctor, lab, radiologist, etc.), so you'd have to negotiate with each of them individually.

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#17

Post by ackbar03 » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:37 PM UTC

dangus wrote: post #9

sumofi wrote: post #3

Not having health insurance is not an excuse. In Germany you are required by law to have it.

This person is actually going to pay less than many people who are insured precisely because they’re uninsured. Someone who is insured in the US is not allowed to negotiate. This person can call the billing department and say “I can’t pay” and watch that bill plummet. The 50% or so of Americans who get their healthcare from solid employers will exhaust their deductible but otherwise be generally fine. Then there’s an…

Wait so there isn't a Healthcare cost problem in America then? I don't live in US but if your uninsured and can just call, say I can't pay and pay much less or just have your insurer pay, it seems to be OK either way?

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#18

Post by krapp » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:40 PM UTC

moosey wrote: post #10

After this is over, the saddest possible outcome is if America returns to the same systems, having learned nothing. I don't expect it at all, but I've been more surprised in the past.

Unless there are millions of deaths in the US from this, a return to the status quo seems like the most likely scenario, as people will assume the scope and danger of the pandemic was overblown by the media all along.

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#19

Post by timavr » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:41 PM UTC

[flagged]

Re: Total Cost of Her Covid-19 Treatment: $34,927.43

#20

Post by dangus » Sat, Mar 21, 2020, 2:46 PM UTC

ackbar03 wrote: post #17

dangus wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This person is actually going to pay less than many people who are insured precisely because they’re uninsured. Someone who is insured in the US is not allowed to negotiate. This person can call the billing department and say “I can’t pay” and watch that bill plummet. The 50% or so of Americans who get their healthcare from solid employers will exhaust their deductible but otherwise be generally fine. Then there’s an…

Wait so there isn't a Healthcare cost problem in America then? I don't live in US but if your uninsured and can just call, say I can't pay and pay much less or just have your insurer pay, it seems to be OK either way?

No, I didn’t say that.

The US healthcare system is messed up in a lot of ways.

I’m just saying that many people who are uninsured at the emergency room will end up with a lower total than people who are insured with unsubsidized low quality insurance.