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Risky hack could double access to ventilators

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21–30 of 164 posts

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#21
post #8

It was my understanding ventilators also do CO2/O2 analysis to understand how to work on the fly, how would that work in this case?

I would assume those numbers would be meaningless. This is a hack, so the main goal would be to simply keep as many people alive as possible.

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#23
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on whether you flatten out the growth rate. It won't/can't keep growing like that when everyone is sheltering in place.

Seems likely. Italy is currently seeing a 13% increase per day while the US is now very close to a 50% increase per day. There are news reports showing beaches and bars in the US are still fully packed. It probably relates the US culture of disregarding expert advice and doing the opposite to "own the scientists"

The US federal government isn't actually doing much at the top level. Individual states are shutting down at variable times and rates. The beaches and bars are mostly in these slow-moving states.

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#24
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on whether you flatten out the growth rate. It won't/can't keep growing like that when everyone is sheltering in place.

Seems likely. Italy is currently seeing a 13% increase per day while the US is now very close to a 50% increase per day. There are news reports showing beaches and bars in the US are still fully packed. It probably relates the US culture of disregarding expert advice and doing the opposite to "own the scientists"

People stop very fast when people they know start to get sick and die.

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#25

Cross infection? F! This solution might be worse than the disease.

More than one person needs the only ventilator. Could you explain how they are worse of sharing a ventilator than being dead?

What types of infections are transmitted? Is it blood borne?

What if you get cross infected with HIV? You get saved from the coronavirus, only to get HIV and die of AIDS. This is not a good trade off either.

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#26

They kept giving reasons why this might not work... * not tested in humans * cross infection potential * different sized people mess it up ... but I see no reason why any of these things would stop me from using this in the real world. If things are bad enough that we need to do this, then we should be able to find relatively similar sized people. Cross contamination is not a concern when someone is dying here and no…

> Cross contamination is not a concern when someone is dying here and now and likely has the same disease as the guy next to him who is also dying If COVID evolves into multiple strains, then there is a real risk of cross-infection that would make the immune system forced to work harder? Moreover, a lot of the pneumonia deaths are not due to covid itself but rather due to opportunistic infections (often bacterial) th…

But it doesn't have to be covid patients. There will still be people who need a ventilator but aren't part of the epidemic, freeing up ventilators for covid patients.

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More than one person needs the only ventilator. Could you explain how they are worse of sharing a ventilator than being dead?

What types of infections are transmitted? Is it blood borne? What if you get cross infected with HIV? You get saved from the coronavirus, only to get HIV and die of AIDS. This is not a good trade off either.

> You get saved from the coronavirus, only to get HIV and die of AIDS. This is not a good trade off either.

Dying from COVID19 in the next few days vs risking HIV and maybe AIDS years or decades later is a pretty obvious choice.

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#29

Cross infection? F! This solution might be worse than the disease.

More than one person needs the only ventilator. Could you explain how they are worse of sharing a ventilator than being dead?

There is a material risk that you are more likely to lose both than just one. I'm sure that having patients share a ventilator increases the risk of death over each having their own. How big that increase is determines whether or not the strategy is valuable.

Re: Risky hack could double access to ventilators

#30
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What types of infections are transmitted? Is it blood borne? What if you get cross infected with HIV? You get saved from the coronavirus, only to get HIV and die of AIDS. This is not a good trade off either.

> You get saved from the coronavirus, only to get HIV and die of AIDS. This is not a good trade off either. Dying from COVID19 in the next few days vs risking HIV and maybe AIDS years or decades later is a pretty obvious choice.

I don’t know. Having HIV and AIDS is the ultimate scarlet letter. It’s the mark of death. Even in this day and age, over 30 years later, the stigma of having it is socially unacceptable, regardless of what is publicly promoted.
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