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Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

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Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#51

Post by jtdev »

dcolkitt wrote: post #28
ta1234567890 wrote: post #12

Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses and individuals. For example, a local restaurant where I live, will have to shut down for good in the next few days as they won't be able to afford their lease. If they get a loan for the lease, they'll be on the hook for that money with no guarantee of being able to pay it back and with way too much uncertainty in terms of when they'll be abl…

> Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses Really disagree on this point. The primary value of a business is their assets, brands and expertise. All of those things will be just as valuable after the pandemic as they were before. Assets don't just disappear because they're not used. This is just as true for small businesses as it is for big business. Any business that was profitable…

We’re not talking about Coca-Cola Corporation there buddy, we’re talking about non franchise restaurants, bars, hotels, salons, etc.

A year of no income for these businesses will cripple them, and coming back to a mountain of debt (even if low interest) will essentially ensure that they never become profitable again.

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#52

Post by advantager »

adventured wrote: post #41
grecy wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I meant was the US is finally starting to adopt a few more socialist policies that are common-place in the Developed World.

They're not Socialist policies, that's a confusion over what Socialism is (total state control of the means of production, as one of several requirements). What you're referring to is called a welfare state. They're welfare state policies, not Socialist policies. The US has been a welfare state nation for many decades now, and increasingly so. For example, there are no Socialist nations in Europe at present, includin…

There was a Freakonomics podcast episode I recently heard that further expands on your point regarding socialist vs. welfare states:

https://freakonomics.com/podcast/socialism/

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#53

Post by ttul »

steveeq1 wrote: post #36

Historically, how long does it take to go to hyperinflation when past governments started doing this? I need to know.

If GDP contracts 10% this year - a real possibility - there is literally zero chance of inflation. The real enemy is deflation.

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#54

Post by JamesBarney »

steveeq1 wrote: post #36

Historically, how long does it take to go to hyperinflation when past governments started doing this? I need to know.

It'll be after we hit 4, 7, 10, 14% inflation. And right now inflation is less than 2% and falling.

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#55

Post by mikeg8 »

dogecoinbase wrote: post #39
dcolkitt wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses Really disagree on this point. The primary value of a business is their assets, brands and expertise. All of those things will be just as valuable after the pandemic as they were before. Assets don't just disappear because they're not used. This is just as true for small businesses as it is for big business. Any business that was profitable…

> Assets don't just disappear because they're not used. This is fundamentally incorrect insofar as the only asset of any small business is typically the labor it employs. Large businesses have intellectual property, capital, real estate, vehicle/equipment fleets, and so on, but nearly all small business have a lease, their on-site inventory (frequently perishable), and their people. All of their ability to continue o…

Over generalizing. Small businesses may own all of the same asset types as large corps, just on a different scale.

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#56

Post by capableweb »

adventured wrote: post #37
LeoNatan25 wrote: post #14

[flagged]

I would suggest doing research on that subject. The US has one of the world's largest, most expensive social safety nets. The primary problem the US has isn't spending on its social safety net, it's not controlling costs properly (as with healthcare in general) and not directing its spending effectively enough. The US spends approximately the equivalent of 40% the entire EU economy on its social safety net. This new…

Maybe in the mandatory spending of the budget, social security is a big part of it, but looking at the discretionary spending which is 50% defense, it sure is a big part of the budget in the US.

And sure, US spends a lot on social security, but how effective is it really? "Safety net" is a lot larger than just social security. For everyone to be able to go to the hospital for free is one thing that contributes to a safety net that the US does not have.

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#57

Post by buckminster »

dcolkitt wrote: post #28
ta1234567890 wrote: post #12

Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses and individuals. For example, a local restaurant where I live, will have to shut down for good in the next few days as they won't be able to afford their lease. If they get a loan for the lease, they'll be on the hook for that money with no guarantee of being able to pay it back and with way too much uncertainty in terms of when they'll be abl…

> Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses Really disagree on this point. The primary value of a business is their assets, brands and expertise. All of those things will be just as valuable after the pandemic as they were before. Assets don't just disappear because they're not used. This is just as true for small businesses as it is for big business. Any business that was profitable…

The business may no longer be profitable because it is now servicing a large debt it didn't previously have. And unlike regular business debt, the money wasn't invested into something productive. This could go very wrong.

Then again, if the business is going bankrupt anyway, who cares how much it ends up owing?

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#58

Post by rguzman »

dcolkitt wrote: post #28
ta1234567890 wrote: post #12

Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses and individuals. For example, a local restaurant where I live, will have to shut down for good in the next few days as they won't be able to afford their lease. If they get a loan for the lease, they'll be on the hook for that money with no guarantee of being able to pay it back and with way too much uncertainty in terms of when they'll be abl…

> Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses Really disagree on this point. The primary value of a business is their assets, brands and expertise. All of those things will be just as valuable after the pandemic as they were before. Assets don't just disappear because they're not used. This is just as true for small businesses as it is for big business. Any business that was profitable…

> The primary value of a business is their assets, brands and expertise. All of those things will be just as valuable after the pandemic as they were before.

this doesn't seem true to me. at least the brand loses value over the pandemic, and there's likely complications from cashflow that eat into other assets.

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#59

Post by grecy »

adventured wrote: post #41
grecy wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I meant was the US is finally starting to adopt a few more socialist policies that are common-place in the Developed World.

They're not Socialist policies, that's a confusion over what Socialism is (total state control of the means of production, as one of several requirements). What you're referring to is called a welfare state. They're welfare state policies, not Socialist policies. The US has been a welfare state nation for many decades now, and increasingly so. For example, there are no Socialist nations in Europe at present, includin…

I disagree with you. Not everything is so black and white that it must be one thing or another. Socialism doesn't have to be "Total state control of the means of production", it can be piecemeal and applied to some parts of a society or economy and not others.

Heathcare for all is not "welfare". It's the government taking tax dollars and then paying for things for all citizens. It's how the USA currently pays for Police and Prisons and the Military and corn subsidies and elementary school teachers among a million other things that are not welfare.

What I'm saying is the US is adopting more socialist ideas, and it's spreading the tax dollars around to more and more citizens in more types of ways, like the rest of the developed world has been doing for decades very successfully.

As I said, I'll be fascinated to see the reaction if and when it's taken back after COVID-19.

Re: Senate passes bill to provide benefits to individuals and small businesses

#60

Post by avip »

dcolkitt wrote: post #28
ta1234567890 wrote: post #12

Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses and individuals. For example, a local restaurant where I live, will have to shut down for good in the next few days as they won't be able to afford their lease. If they get a loan for the lease, they'll be on the hook for that money with no guarantee of being able to pay it back and with way too much uncertainty in terms of when they'll be abl…

> Loans, even cheap ones, are a very shity way of "helping" small businesses Really disagree on this point. The primary value of a business is their assets, brands and expertise. All of those things will be just as valuable after the pandemic as they were before. Assets don't just disappear because they're not used. This is just as true for small businesses as it is for big business. Any business that was profitable…

You seem to be conflating some Bezos-level corp. owner with a poor guy cooking Raman down the street.
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