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Why N95 masks are hard to make

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Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#81

Post by bitL »

bootlooped wrote: post #76
bitL wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surgical masks are protecting patients not doctors. Please educate yourself. "The coronavirus is an upper respiratory virus and a surgical mask does not protect you from that kind of virus,” he said. “In fact, when people buy up these masks and hoard these masks then they might not be available for healthcare providers to use for patient care.” He said surgical masks are more effective on people who are already infec…

"(N95) Masks won't protect you" was an expedient lie. How can it be that medical professionals are in dire need of N95 masks to protect them from the virus, yet they are powerless to do any good in the hands of the public? https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/17/opinion/coronavirus-face-... If everybody in the US could wear one of these when out in public, we would be in a much better place. The sad truth is we don't have…

N95 is not a surgical mask. That one is a professional respirator. Yet infection can enter via eyes, so one has to wear airtight glasses as well to be sure.

Surgical mask looks like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surgical_mask

There is no respirator embedded as you can see, it's just a simple piece of fabric.

The point of my original reply was that we could reduce R0/transmission rate only if everybody had to wear surgical mask in public. If you are the only one wearing it, it doesn't really help. Some EU countries now require everybody to wear a mask while shopping or using public transport.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#82

Post by muzani »

koolba wrote: post #4

> China now makes 200 million face masks a day — more than twenty times the amount it made at the start of February. That’s an insane number of masks. Does one in seven Chinese wear a fresh one every day ? Is this gonna be the new normal?

I bought N95 masks a few times. It was pricey - about as much as a latte. I can't afford that every day, so I recycled the mask a few times. (This was not for COVID-19, but some other issues when my wife was in ICU and air pollution issues)

China can export those masks if they're not using them. Right now it's printing money. But even when this pandemic blows over, they'll still sell for a good price in countries without that manufacturing capacity.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#83

Post by bitL »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #67
bitL wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surgical masks are protecting patients not doctors. Please educate yourself. "The coronavirus is an upper respiratory virus and a surgical mask does not protect you from that kind of virus,” he said. “In fact, when people buy up these masks and hoard these masks then they might not be available for healthcare providers to use for patient care.” He said surgical masks are more effective on people who are already infec…

https://www.health.com/condition/cold-flu-sinus/surgical-mas... >“Yes, a surgical mask can help prevent the flu,” Sherif Mossad, MD, an infectious disease specialist at the Cleveland Clinic, tells Health. “Flu is carried in air droplets, so a mask would mechanically prevent the flu virus from reaching other people.” It would work both ways, says Dr. Mossad, preventing transmission of the flu virus to others and for k…

“Disposable is best and you should discard your mask after each use,” says Dr. Besser. “If a mask gets wet—and it will by simply breathing into it—the effectiveness of its protective effect is reduced.”

Are you really going to change your surgical mask every 3 minutes to make it effective against getting infected?

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#84

Post by bitL »

gwright wrote: post #66
bitL wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surgical masks are protecting patients not doctors. Please educate yourself. "The coronavirus is an upper respiratory virus and a surgical mask does not protect you from that kind of virus,” he said. “In fact, when people buy up these masks and hoard these masks then they might not be available for healthcare providers to use for patient care.” He said surgical masks are more effective on people who are already infec…

> The coronavirus is an upper respiratory virus I thought it was a lower respiratory virus. I have no idea if that changes the efficacy of masks but...

My understanding is that it starts as an upper respiratory virus (mainly concentrated in the throat), leading to flu/cold-like symptoms and only those unlucky ones that get it deep in their lungs attached to ACE2 receptors end up with a life-threatening lower respiratory illness requiring ICU and ventilator/ECMO due to immunity going berserk and killing off lung tissue with virus embedded in it, a cytokine storm.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#85

Post by Consultant32452 »

bitL wrote: post #83
Consultant32452 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.health.com/condition/cold-flu-sinus/surgical-mas... >“Yes, a surgical mask can help prevent the flu,” Sherif Mossad, MD, an infectious disease specialist at the Cleveland Clinic, tells Health. “Flu is carried in air droplets, so a mask would mechanically prevent the flu virus from reaching other people.” It would work both ways, says Dr. Mossad, preventing transmission of the flu virus to others and for k…

“Disposable is best and you should discard your mask after each use,” says Dr. Besser. “If a mask gets wet—and it will by simply breathing into it—the effectiveness of its protective effect is reduced.” Are you really going to change your surgical mask every 3 minutes to make it effective against getting infected?

Do surgeons change their surgical masks every 3 minutes while performing surgery? And the operative word the doctor used is "reduced" effectiveness, not "eliminated" effectiveness.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#86

Post by threatofrain »

droithomme wrote: post #2

Surgical and homemade masks are much better than nothing. And by better than nothing we mean reasonably effective. Going into close contact with a person who has a known transmissible respiratory illness? N95 is minimum if you are a professional. And get your union to scream bloody murder if you are not allowed this essential safety equipment, and put complaints in writing so your heirs can later sue to oblivion. Try…

I think people should be allowed to wear masks, but I think that a lot of this information, including a very full vision about what's going to happen in the next 6 months to 1 year, needs to come from CDC and other major institutions.

Everyone on the ground having little ad hoc debates doesn't seem like it will converge onto a nationally organized solution. The fact that this is happening is symptomatic of the lack of leadership IMO, and so instead we're getting a disorganized cascade of businesses, institutions, mayors, and governors making ad hoc calls.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#87

Post by bitL »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #85
bitL wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Disposable is best and you should discard your mask after each use,” says Dr. Besser. “If a mask gets wet—and it will by simply breathing into it—the effectiveness of its protective effect is reduced.” Are you really going to change your surgical mask every 3 minutes to make it effective against getting infected?

Do surgeons change their surgical masks every 3 minutes while performing surgery? And the operative word the doctor used is "reduced" effectiveness, not "eliminated" effectiveness.

Surgeons wear it so that their breath/mouth droplets don't end up in patient's intenstines while performing a surgery, causing an infection. For that purpose a single surgical mask can last hours (i.e. it keeps droplets on the inner surface of the mask). If they have to perform surgery on highly dangerous patients, they use hazmat suits instead:

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-9bd2e88c4296be54e7f845...

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#88

Post by doodlebugging »

chuckledog wrote: post #65
Leary wrote: post #26

"Currently, of the 200 million masks China makes a day, only 600,000 are N95 standard masks, used by medical personnel, according to the National Development and Reform Commission, a state planning body. " Wow, that is not enough.

There is quite is quite a bit of information readily available about sterilizing disposable N95 masks with UV-C light. While not nearly as good as a fresh mask, this might be a preferable alternative to reusing the same mask unsterilized. https://www.ajicjournal.org/article/S0196-6553(18)30140-8/pd... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4699414/ https://www.peakprosperity.com/forum-topic/can-uv-light-disi...…

I believe that microwaving a used mask could also be an effective way to sterilize the mask. (0)

I found this information by following links from the CDC website a few weeks ago when I was exploring the possibility of buying masks for my family and found that they were already being hawked online at ridiculous prices.

Perhaps steam and/or use of a pressure cooker could also be effective. Many people who do home canning of food goods have a pressure cooker and are already familiar with usage and cleaning.

The article posted suggests that this could be a viable method of home decontamination of used masks if I read it right. I also found an article that touched on use of a steamer to accomplish similar results. I can't find that article right now but if I do I will post it for review. Microwaving alone, without adding water to generate the steam should kill most water-based organisms. The article I read stated that microwave times from 30 seconds to 5 minutes were used. I need to find that article...

What does everyone else think? I'd be interested in hearing.

(0) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3078131/

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#89

Post by echelon »

bootlooped wrote: post #52
echelon wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the workers being replaced by automation and having to rely on "gig economy" work could pursue manufacturing instead. We have the workforce. We can pay workers livable wages and give them meaningful work. Cost of goods could be reduced through greater efficiency. Research into robotics and automation could fuel a new decade of American growth.

How can you in once sentence say we can employ workers previously displaced by automation, and in the next sentence assert that we can produce these goods at a competitive price with automation?

I should proofread and given examples. Lack of caffeine from WFH isn't helping me.

There are many types of automation. Grocery workers (cashiers, stockers) are replaced with robotics and self-checkout (which automates pricing and theft detection) that removes them from the equation. Automobile machinists and doctors are supplemented with robotics that let them do higher-precision work and avoid mundane and/or stressful tasks.

The gig economy is driven by automation (customer discovery, billing, payroll, etc.), but the industry is set up in a way that happens to produce negative externalities and push risks and costs onto workers.

We need the type of automation that reduces mindless repetition and extends human capability. Not the kind geared at removing people.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#90

Post by hnaccy »

Larrikin wrote: post #8
koolba wrote: post #4

> China now makes 200 million face masks a day — more than twenty times the amount it made at the start of February. That’s an insane number of masks. Does one in seven Chinese wear a fresh one every day ? Is this gonna be the new normal?

They only provide protection for four hours

Really? 3M says to replace if they become too hard to breath through or are soiled.

http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/447121O/filter-change-out...

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