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Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

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191–200 of 266 posts

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#191
It really needn't be about money. Neither how much, nor how distributed. A pandemic is mostly about human behaviour, which is social.

No need to keep imagining that there is a strong causal link with money in the short term. At least not so much as it might matter.

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most important aspect of the claim about spending money is the broken window fallacy. Henry Hazlitt wrote a great book on the subject called Economics in One lesson. The simple example is that we can't go around breaking windows to stimulate the economy. Sure, the window manufacturer and the window replacement companies might benefit, however that money which went towards the window could have gone elsewhere. Eng…

It's hard to be an Austrian and a decent human being. Moral hazard is real, but it's hard to stand by and watch humans suffer in a world full of abundance.

> It's hard to be an Austrian and a decent human being. Moral hazard is real, but it's hard to stand by and watch humans suffer in a world full of abundance.

Pardon the negativity, but this is a childish way to disagree with someone. Very few people think "I don't care what happens to people", mostly simply think there are better ways to do the most good. A person's inability to understand someone else's morality doesn't make that person superior, it makes them arrogant and ignorant.

It's much better to "steel man" a point of view, find the strengths in its arguments and understand it, then argue against those rather than just dismissing it out of hand because it doesn't align with your presuppositions.

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#193

As long as the money is given to folks who need and/or will spend it, it feels like this is the exact situation where the federal government steps in for stimulus. There’s no pull yourself up by your bootstraps talk right now and there shouldn’t be. I know the single parent working a couple of jobs will spend every dime they’re given in a time like this, just to survive. A yuppie like me would just park it in my savi…

> A yuppie like me would just park it in my savings account until I feel we hit bottom, then invest it.

I would personally feel obligated to spend it, and I normally save 75% of my income.

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#194
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure people in the top 10% are not likely to need this money, but giving it to everyone is a lot easier and faster than figuring out who needs it the most. Even in that top 10% there are still people that live paycheck-to-paycheck. I was there not long ago. It's a lot better to give everyone the money and be wrong about ~10% of the people needing it then delay it for people who have bill past due right now.

Why isn't it a direct credit towards rent and free food/water/meds instead of cash? Wouldn't that be a way to ensure it isn't stowed away?

Why do you care if some people just save it instead of spending on the necessities?

What about people for whom this is pretty close to their rent/food/entertainment budget anyway? You want them to sit in their houses staring at each other with no way to pay their bills for [insert streaming entertainment service here]?

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#196
Corporations are owned by people. "84 percent of all stocks owned by Americans belong to the wealthiest 10 percent of households."[0] Bailing our corporations bails out the wealthy.

Send money to everyone equally. It's fast. It's fair. And it will quickly increase the velocity of money. [1]

[0] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/08/business/economy/stocks-e...

[1] https://www.investopedia.com/terms/v/velocity.asp

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#197

As long as the money is given to folks who need and/or will spend it, it feels like this is the exact situation where the federal government steps in for stimulus. There’s no pull yourself up by your bootstraps talk right now and there shouldn’t be. I know the single parent working a couple of jobs will spend every dime they’re given in a time like this, just to survive. A yuppie like me would just park it in my savi…

normally a stimulus works because if you give people $1000, people will go and spend at least some of it. With most options for discretionary spending shut down, there's really just two things left to spend on: rent and groceries (and i guess: amazon orders).

$1000 to every american right now will end up just being a huge payment to landlords. i'm not saying it's a bad idea, people still need to make rent and buy food, but it's not going to stimulate anything. grocery stores are already bringing in record revenues, and landlords don't need the money. It's financial aid, not a stimulus.

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#198

Why can't we collectively say, no Americans have to pay mortgages/rent for x months. No small/medium sized businesses have to pay business loans for x months. Everyone focus on social distancing and making sure everyone has food and shelter. Weather this out, and start back up after peak infections/hospitalizations has been dealt with.

Yeah, I feel like this would be cheaper without propping up banks or landlords who don’t have a mortgage. I don’t know if most payment software can handle it but you basically set back any mortgages by N months. Similar for rent you somehow mark it as paid, whatever that arrangement looks like.

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#199

Hey, maybe they could stop trying to kill SNAP while they're at it https://www.cbpp.org/research/food-assistance/presidents-bud... https://www.vox.com/identities/2020/3/13/21178257/trump-admi...

Also the sick leave bill? pretty half assed to start with and they just made it even more half assed. https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1239729011187744773.html

Re: Giving Americans Money to Offset Coronavirus Impact Gains Support in Congress

#200

As long as the money is given to folks who need and/or will spend it, it feels like this is the exact situation where the federal government steps in for stimulus. There’s no pull yourself up by your bootstraps talk right now and there shouldn’t be. I know the single parent working a couple of jobs will spend every dime they’re given in a time like this, just to survive. A yuppie like me would just park it in my savi…

How do you decide who needs it? I think the sane option really would be to give it to everyone and increase taxes to compensate. Progressive taxes fall most heavily on those that can afford them. They are the best tool for this job.

Of course to really get this fair, you should tax wealth too, which tends to be difficult...

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