How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel • Hacker News Board

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#41

Post by parallel » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:48 AM UTC

miguelmota wrote: post #33

rosybox wrote: post #20

Just FYI, if you're lying to get out of paying for something, or to get reimbursed on false pretenses that is called fraud and is illegal. It's also wrong to do, it is an action taken in bad faith.

Not all policies are fair and there should be exceptions during times of crisis. Hotels do questionable advertising practices all the time to lure in customers and then hit them with arbitrary fees during checkout which seems like bad faith to me.

This is the "two wrongs" argument. They do bad things so we should be able to do bad things back.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#42

Post by lmartel » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:51 AM UTC

chadash wrote: post #36

nexuist wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it is an action taken in bad faith So is a hotel denying you a refund during an epidemic. There is an obvious power differential here between Joe Blow and some billion dollar hotel chain. You need the money for basic survival far more than they need it to pad their quarterly earnings.

By booking a non-refundable rate, which is generally cheaper, you took that risk. So long as the hotel is open, it's not really their problem. The fact that they have more money than you doesn't give you the right to steal from them. If you really need the money for basic survival, fine, we can argue about the morality of it . But even with a possible recession looming, it's unlikely that the price of a hotel stay is…

Nonrefundable rates are not marketed as a bet against global catastrophe. They're a commitment that you won't change your mind.

This epidemic is more similar to the hotel burning down. I would expect my money back in that scenario and do whatever I could to retrieve it.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#43

Post by sjtgraham » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:51 AM UTC

rosybox wrote: post #20

Just FYI, if you're lying to get out of paying for something, or to get reimbursed on false pretenses that is called fraud and is illegal. It's also wrong to do, it is an action taken in bad faith.

It doesn’t really matter. With this simplistic view the hotel is breaching the contract. There is a mutuality of obligation. If the customer is obligated to pay for a room then the hotel is obligated to provide the service.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#44

Post by noncoml » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:51 AM UTC

miguelmota wrote: post #33

rosybox wrote: post #20

Just FYI, if you're lying to get out of paying for something, or to get reimbursed on false pretenses that is called fraud and is illegal. It's also wrong to do, it is an action taken in bad faith.

Not all policies are fair and there should be exceptions during times of crisis. Hotels do questionable advertising practices all the time to lure in customers and then hit them with arbitrary fees during checkout which seems like bad faith to me.

How is it fair for the hotel to pay for the consumer's gamble in booking a non-refundable room?

They just got unlucky and they should suck it up.

If the hotel has to refund everyone, it will either have to go under, or if it is too big to fail, be bailed out with my money.

I don't see why I should pay for someone's else gamble.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#45

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:55 AM UTC

nexuist wrote: post #28

rosybox wrote: post #20

Just FYI, if you're lying to get out of paying for something, or to get reimbursed on false pretenses that is called fraud and is illegal. It's also wrong to do, it is an action taken in bad faith.

> it is an action taken in bad faith So is a hotel denying you a refund during an epidemic. There is an obvious power differential here between Joe Blow and some billion dollar hotel chain. You need the money for basic survival far more than they need it to pad their quarterly earnings.

[deleted]

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#46

Post by Ghjklov » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:56 AM UTC

3fe9a03ccd14ca5 wrote: post #19

bb88 wrote: post #6

TLDR: Use the excuse you returned from Italy and need an extension of several days to self quarantine. It might work now, but maybe not when hotels start catching on and requiring proof.

Honestly these hotels are probably losing so much money right now that they’d gladly take a covid patient.

There's an idea there, what if we turned empty hotel rooms into covid-19 care facilities? Then you can isolate a good number of infected in one place that you can keep an eye on.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#47

Post by rosybox » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:57 AM UTC

sjtgraham wrote: post #43

rosybox wrote: post #20

Just FYI, if you're lying to get out of paying for something, or to get reimbursed on false pretenses that is called fraud and is illegal. It's also wrong to do, it is an action taken in bad faith.

It doesn’t really matter. With this simplistic view the hotel is breaching the contract. There is a mutuality of obligation. If the customer is obligated to pay for a room then the hotel is obligated to provide the service.

If that is so then you should make your point without having to create a false story.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#48

Post by ajxs » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 4:59 AM UTC

I'd be very surprised if there was one ounce of truth to this. I've worked implementing payment systems for large institutions. It's standard for the existing balance of the transaction to be taken into account when an amendment is made to a purchase that has yet to be settled.

Example: You purchase $100 worth of widgets, process the payment then 5 minutes later call up and add another $100 of widgets to your order prior to the order being shipped. Your original purchase won't get refunded. Your order will be amended and you'll be charged another $100 to settle the outstanding amount. I'd be a little surprised if something as sophisticated as a hotel booking system didn't implement a basic account ledger.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#49

Post by listenallyall » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 5:01 AM UTC

lmartel wrote: post #42

chadash wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By booking a non-refundable rate, which is generally cheaper, you took that risk. So long as the hotel is open, it's not really their problem. The fact that they have more money than you doesn't give you the right to steal from them. If you really need the money for basic survival, fine, we can argue about the morality of it . But even with a possible recession looming, it's unlikely that the price of a hotel stay is…

Nonrefundable rates are not marketed as a bet against global catastrophe. They're a commitment that you won't change your mind. This epidemic is more similar to the hotel burning down. I would expect my money back in that scenario and do whatever I could to retrieve it.

No, they are marketed as "non-refundable." As in, you don't come, you don't get a refund. End of story.

With that said, many hotel chains and airlines have suspended their typical non-refundable rules, so a simple phone call would likely suffice.

Re: How to get your money back on a non-refundable hotel

#50

Post by fortran77 » Tue, Mar 17, 2020, 5:02 AM UTC

rosybox wrote: post #20

Just FYI, if you're lying to get out of paying for something, or to get reimbursed on false pretenses that is called fraud and is illegal. It's also wrong to do, it is an action taken in bad faith.

The Hacker News "hackers" have no moral compass, especially when it's "the little guy" vs a "corporation" of any sort.