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Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

nytimes.com

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Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#61

Post by gsich »

lnsru wrote: post #37

That will end in another monstrosity like WEEE making entry for hardware startups harder and harder: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waste_Electrical_and_Electro... Only big players with dedicated departments will comply easily. And about right to repair I have bad experience: broken cable is enough for lots of buyers to throw away electronic appliances. Let’s be honest: majority of users will cause more harm than do…

Why? Most of the time you design your stuff deliberately to not be easy to repair, see Apple, see every mobile phone/notebook with a non-replaceable battery.

Just don't do that and you're fine. Publish your schematics too, they are not a company secret, they are for your customers.

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#62

Post by listsfrin »

simion314 wrote: post #55
listsfrin wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then maybe they should strive to recycle instead to repair.

It depends, most of the time the issue is a small component from a big system failing. This large companies should not block a competent repairman to diagnose and replace the broken part. I am not asking companies to make Lego phones just don't block people with DRM,copyright and supply chain restrictions.

They block competent repairman? Or they ask money for competent repair?

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#63

Post by qayxc »

lnsru wrote: post #37

That will end in another monstrosity like WEEE making entry for hardware startups harder and harder: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waste_Electrical_and_Electro... Only big players with dedicated departments will comply easily. And about right to repair I have bad experience: broken cable is enough for lots of buyers to throw away electronic appliances. Let’s be honest: majority of users will cause more harm than do…

> Let’s be honest: majority of users will cause more harm than do good when repairing something.

What kind of argument is that? Right to repair isn't about you and me fiddling about with with broken appliances.

It's about qualified and licensed people in repair shops being able to acquire parts and schematics to do their job. No one is arguing that your average Jane or Joe should be ones doing the repair! That's just another strawman that is easily dismantled...

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#64

Post by asjw »

maest wrote: post #26
asjw wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hope it does

Why?

For a simple reason: if a product is anti consumer rights, it's good if it is not sold here in Europe

Toxic kids toys are not sold in Europe, is it bad?

Europe has the right to set their own quality standards, companies have the right to not respect them and say goodbye to European market

What's wrong with that?

It could also start a new wave of European brands which are seriously lacking right now

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#65

Post by asjw »

listsfrin wrote: post #36

The article says this is needed in order to reduce greenhouse emissions. I don't feel that's true. In my country in Europe nothing is done to reduce pollution from the cars and plastic usage. Year after year more products are built with plastic instead of glass or metal.

Car parts are being made in plastic for safety reasons

And it's completely renewable

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#66

Post by matz1 »

TomMarius wrote: post #17
rat9988 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a society we have to make choices. We prefer having repairable items over beautiful unrepairable ones, as the latter has been abused as an excuse to deny repairability even when possible.

Do we? I am not really sure we do. I think it's very hard to talk about what "the society" wants, and I know that it differs very much around 150 km to the north from me (where the border is) and that it is also roughly the opposite around 300 km to the south from me (where another border is).

Yes in the end its a preference, we have to make choices and I too would like to have the choice to buy unrepairable item. We too are "the society" so if we want to still have the option we have to fight the law. One thing to do is obviously do not vote for or support the law .

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#67

Post by pas »

listsfrin wrote: post #48
jotm wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure? I mean, European directives are not always implemented perfectly, but all countries do try to. It may be that your country is doing something, it's just not noticeable, yet. This is long term stuff, results are only apparent years or decades after the laws come into effect.

I live in my country and I know some things about it. Germany allows people to sell old cars in Eastern Europe. My country will take those cars without any limits. This is the Europe that I'm living in. Crossing the street in the morning is an exercise of how long can you hold your breath.

Most Eastern European countries are actually doing well compared to the big wealthy countries in terms of CO2. (Not necessarily in terms of other air quality stuff.)

https://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-maps/indicators/greenhous... [see fig 4 about targets for 2020 and actual changes in emissions for 2017 and 2018]

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#68

Post by ptsneves »

listsfrin wrote: post #48
jotm wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure? I mean, European directives are not always implemented perfectly, but all countries do try to. It may be that your country is doing something, it's just not noticeable, yet. This is long term stuff, results are only apparent years or decades after the laws come into effect.

I live in my country and I know some things about it. Germany allows people to sell old cars in Eastern Europe. My country will take those cars without any limits. This is the Europe that I'm living in. Crossing the street in the morning is an exercise of how long can you hold your breath.

Most likely a coal problem than cars. At least in Poland and most likely Czech Republic and Slovakia where lignite coal is abundant.

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#69

Post by jka »

lnsru wrote: post #37

That will end in another monstrosity like WEEE making entry for hardware startups harder and harder: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waste_Electrical_and_Electro... Only big players with dedicated departments will comply easily. And about right to repair I have bad experience: broken cable is enough for lots of buyers to throw away electronic appliances. Let’s be honest: majority of users will cause more harm than do…

Which parts of the potential legislation do you have concerns about with regard to difficulty for new entrants?

Product obsolescence does seem to be a concern that the EU wishes to address:

"The Commission will propose legislation on Sustainable Product Policy, to ensure that products placed on the EU market are designed to last longer, are easier to reuse, repair and recycle, and incorporate as much as possible recycled material instead of primary raw material. Single-use will be restricted, premature obsolescence tackled and the destruction of unsold durable goods banned."[0]

I also think that legislating to ensure that issues such as energy efficiency, durability, repairability and recycling must be considered during the design phase are great progress too, as outlined in the Circular Economy Action Plan[1].

It's important to raise those concerns and get involved to help shape the process and outcomes.

[0] - https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_...

[1] - https://ec.europa.eu/environment/circular-economy/pdf/new_ci...

Re: Europe Wants a ‘Right to Repair’ Smartphones and Gadgets

#70

Post by as1mov »

lnsru wrote: post #37

That will end in another monstrosity like WEEE making entry for hardware startups harder and harder: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waste_Electrical_and_Electro... Only big players with dedicated departments will comply easily. And about right to repair I have bad experience: broken cable is enough for lots of buyers to throw away electronic appliances. Let’s be honest: majority of users will cause more harm than do…

> Let’s be honest: majority of users will cause more harm than do good when repairing something.

Yep, let's make everything a black box that can only be repaired under the watchful eye of a corporation, and they retain the right to refuse the repair and charge whatever the fuck they want. That's surely gonna work out well. That's surely gonna work out well.

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