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U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

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Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#901

Post by mnm1 »

allsystemsgo wrote: post #478
mnm1 wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah it's clearly a token move to pretend like they're doing something. The cv19 test is free but all the other tests they will undoubtedly and necessarily run before that are not. And if you end up in the er as a poor person, you'll likely go bankrupt or take a massive hit even with insurance. That'll keep people away. Who knows how long it'll be before we have massive testing like Korea. Maybe never.

Just because CV19 is a thing now doesn’t mean the US magically has Medicare for all.

So in your mind, Medicare for all only covers covid 19? Because that's what I'm talking about. Covering treatment for the once in a hundred years pandemic. Clearly, even that's too much for our shitty, decaying American society. In the meantime every other developed nation has a proper healthcare system while we can barely test for this due to our incompetence and shit leaders.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#902

Post by yellowapple »

hcknwscommenter wrote: post #676
yellowapple wrote: post #533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> where was your cruise Los Angeles → Catalina Islands → Ensenada → Los Angeles > and were there lots of mainland Chinese people on it? I mean, I didn't exactly go around asking people "are you from China?", but based on the number of people who sounded like they were speaking Mandarin I'd tentatively answer "yes". > Sadly the symptoms for CoVid-19 are pretty common across a variety of diseases, so “flu-like but not…

Lots of people live in LA who haven't been to China in decades speak Chinese as a first language. The relevant question is whether there were many people on that cruise directly visiting directly from Wuhan/Hubei. LA-catalina-ensenada-LA? Doubt it. Not exactly the type of cruise someone flies thousands of miles for.

True. Like I said, it ain't like I was going around asking people if they're from Wuhan, lol

That said, you'd be surprised what draws tourists from mainland China; Las Vegas and Reno (for example) both get plenty of Chinese tourists looking specifically to gamble, and I'd imagine the ship's onboard casino to have a similar appeal. Plus, there were plenty of other tourists from long distances, too, both from within the US (East Coast) and from Europe and Australia (from what I gathered from the people whom I did talk to). So evidently there were at least some non-Chinese tourists flying thousands of miles for it; seems reasonable that some mainland Chinese tourists might, too.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#903

Post by droithomme »

irq11 wrote: post #231
divbzero wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does this mean we need a more robust domestic response to contain coronavirus, instead of or in addition to restricting travel to the US? Akin to how securing a network is more than setting up a firewall at the perimeter.

It cannot be contained. That’s what the pandemic declaration means (even though the WHO should have done this weeks ago). At this point, the only rational thing to do is to try to slow the spread. The good news is that this is a very mild virus, and the vast majority of infected people will have minor symptoms. The fatality rate in Korea is currently 0.6%, and becuase of the comprehensive nature of their testing, thi…

> this is a very mild virus

Media and government keep making this claim, yet where are the recovery numbers of people? It drags on for weeks and weeks with no end in sight, correct? And current case fatality rate in Italy is 8%, was 7% this morning, was 6% yesterday - because they do not have hospital resources for the number of serious cases they have.

Serious, critical, and dead outcomes are said to be over 20% of case. This being described as "very low, a very small number" by certain people. That is not a low number at all.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#904

Post by droithomme »

ebiester wrote: post #829
hcknwscommenter wrote: post #668

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the upper bound on CFR" I think you mean that this should be considered the goal upper bound on CFR. It's really the lower bound on CFR if you do everything right. If you do everything wrong, like the US is heading towards, you get overloaded health systems, critical shortages, and a 12% CFR or higher.

A 12% CFR is overstating it, but also because we won't be counting the heart attacks that weren't treated, the chemo and radiation therapy that was postponed, and the other health effects. I think the true measure will be the year over year total mortality.

> 12% CFR is overstating it

If we overload our hospitals then CFR will go towards the number of cases that require hospitalization. Which is around 20%. Italy is currently far over hospital capacity and has a CFR today of 8% and rising.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#905

Post by irq11 »

floriol wrote: post #881
irq11 wrote: post #556

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, first: no. The vast majority of cases are no worse than a head cold. But more importantly, you’re not dying and not clogging up a hospital. That’s what’s relevant to this discussion.

But that's not true. While lethality is estimated at tops 3.6%, the cases requiring hospitalization, including breathing apparatus, etc are quite high, and it WILL overflood the capacity of hospitals in virtually every country that didn't take really really serious precautions, of which there are only a handful. It will be a big problem both in Europe and in the US, because they are starting to take measures only now…

What part of what I said isn’t true?

The vast majority of cases are mild, like a head cold. This is a fact, and has been reported around the world.

You’re arguing about relative hospitalization rates, but that has nothing to do with the discussion here. Mild cases aren’t clogging up ICU wards at all, because they’re quite mild.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#906

Post by wpietri »

egdod wrote: post #858
wpietri wrote: post #644

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then perhaps the people saying that have different purposes. Which I'm sure was dlp211's point as well.

Sure, but I’m not obliged to give any deference to improper purposes like delegitimization of the President.

You don't get to decide what is proper for other people's purposes. They do.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#907

Post by koheripbal »

unlinked_dll wrote: post #193
Scoundreller wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can anyone comment on supply chains that rely on Europe to source goods? I know medical grade steel comes from over there, but I don't know what else. I don't see why commercial sea-shipping would be restricted. Mariners may not be allowed to leave their ship while in port though.

Because the President said so during his address, which is why I commented. Apparently he misspoke when he said cargo would be included.

No - they said freight would continue unobstructed.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#908

Post by code_duck »

blaser-waffle wrote: post #850
hcknwscommenter wrote: post #665

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"His actions clearly indicate he doesn't believe it is a hoax." Huh? He called Fox News and said on air ""So if, you know, we have thousands or hundreds of thousands of people [with COVID-19] that get better, just by, you know, sitting around and even going to work, some of them go to work, but they get better,"" His whole schtick until just about a few hours ago was that the risks were all hugely overblown. I am als…

I don't know if I'd call that blatantly partisan. Stupid, perhaps, or a hamfisted attempt to prevent panics and economic crashes, but it's not especially political.

Given the impacts that the stock market crash and his handling of the virus crisis are likely to have on the election, it is definitely a political matter. Realistically any time a president comments on anything it is a political matter.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#909

Post by fareesh »

officemonkey wrote: post #894
fareesh wrote: post #889

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A knife can be used to murder but if you point that out to the chef discussing technique in the kitchen, then you are not adding useful information to the conversation.

It's entirely appropriate to tell the chef he's about to cut off his thumb. You're not an expert and you're spouting xenophobic bullshit. Take the L.

Which would be relevant in a discussion about technique.

Murder and knife crime discussions would not be.

A knife can be used for those things, but when discussing knives in cooking it makes no sense to talk about those topics.

Likewise in a discussion wherein the example of the farmer trying to protect the herd from a predator by closing the fence after the predator is already inside the farm - it is not the selection of predator animal used in the example which is the topic at hand. The example is used to illustrate the futility of the act. It does not mean that the government is a farmer. It does not mean the people are farm animals. Farm animals do not elect their farmers. Farmers do not have 3 branches and an independent judiciary or a legislature. Getting into these aspects of the comparison make no sense whatsoever. Likewise getting into the specifics of the coyote - patient zero comparison also serves no purpose. Coyotes have 4 legs and a snout. Humans don't have snouts, we have noses. Discussing all of this is not productive at all.

Also what xenophobic thing have I discussed? I am pointing out the fact that the comment you were replying to used an analogy - which is a linguistic device intended to draw a comparison. There are many phrases and figures of speech like "fox in the hen house" and "bull in a China shop" or "frog in the well". These phrases are never intended to compare the person to an actual fox or bull or frog.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#910

Post by benzible »

gpm wrote: post #838
anigbrowl wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Misspoke? It was a prepared statement read off a teleprompter. Please don't excuse it like a slip of the tongue.

Here is the paragraph from the transcript ( https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-pres... ) > There will be exemptions for Americans who have undergone appropriate screenings, and these prohibitions will not only apply to the tremendous amount of trade and cargo, but various other things as we get approval. Anything coming from Europe to the United States is what we are discussing. These restriction…

Yep looks like that's what happened: https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1238310742748811264?s=20
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