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U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

nbcnews.com

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Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#101

Post by Mountain_Skies »

Scoundreller wrote: post #60

From the NYT article: "He [Trump] said he would instruct the Treasury Department to “defer tax payments without interest or penalties for certain individuals and businesses negatively impacted.” Why deferments for businesses? Don't they only pay tax on profits?

Probably is targeted more at small businesses who might have trouble getting all of their bookkeeping and records in order in time to file in a few weeks. If this somehow benefits large corporations, they will no doubt take full advantage of the situation.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#102

Post by paxys »

maxerickson wrote: post #74
moosey wrote: post #58

I feel like there are some particular cultural attributes in the United States that make this useless at this point. The United States has a very individualistic attitude. Sure, we can pause travel from Europe, but the current administration is very anti-europe. Can we pause travel in the US? I strongly doubt that we can effectively given the strong anti-expertise attitudes as well. My guess is that the United States…

There are lots of individualists that will flout advice, but there's also lots of people that will isolate themselves in quite a paranoid fashion. I think there's more of the latter.

More or less doesn't matter. It's a classic case of "one person can ruin it for everyone", which is why in many countries there is strict enforcement rather than just recommendations.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#103

Post by corel_ »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #53
knzhou wrote: post #17

I get that they excluded the UK for diplomatic reasons, but it's literally only a few days behind the rest of Europe in terms of infection count, which means this will have almost no effect. I actually think banning travel from China months ago was a good call, but by analogous reasoning, the right time to ban travel from Europe (including the UK) was last week.

The reason the UK is behind continental Europe is the lack of testing. Their numbers are no worse than continental Europe (excluding Italy, of course). The US, on the other hand, are lightyears behind Europe on testing, the real number of infections is closer to 5000 than to 1250, again bringing it in line with the rest of Europe.

>The reason the UK is behind continental Europe is the lack of testing

Can you elaborate on this with some sources?

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#104

Post by Animats »

Scoundreller wrote: post #55
unlinked_dll wrote: post #30

Regardless of the ability of people to travel to the UK or Canada and get here (which people have done for a long time with other nations we don't take kindly to) it's absolutely going to reduce the number of people who will travel across the pond. Which is the goal, reduce infection rates. My concern is how economies are going to respond to the US being cut off from Continental ports for a month, which as far as I c…

> Can anyone comment on supply chains that rely on Europe to source goods? I know medical grade steel comes from over there, but I don't know what else. I don't see why commercial sea-shipping would be restricted. Mariners may not be allowed to leave their ship while in port though.

I don't see why commercial sea-shipping would be restricted.

Me either, but Trump did seem to say that. Vaguely. Stand by for "clarification".

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#107

Post by legolas2412 »

corel_ wrote: post #80
nugget wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The situation in Europe will be much worse a month from now than it is today, unfortunately. I'd bet on this ban lasting closer to 90 days than 30.

I'm not sure where this level of panic is coming from. Numbers are about to spike everywhere pretty much no matter what anybody does, because better testing and funding has become available. Quarantining an entire continent, and even worse than this badly doing it, seems to be an astonishing overreaction. The average age of death for coronavirus victims is 83. The mortality rate seems to be as low as 0.6% in South Ko…

Europe or North America are not being quarantined off. And if people don't take measures, all healthcare is going to be overwhelmed.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#108

Post by corel_ »

knzhou wrote: post #94
corel_ wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure where this level of panic is coming from. Numbers are about to spike everywhere pretty much no matter what anybody does, because better testing and funding has become available. Quarantining an entire continent, and even worse than this badly doing it, seems to be an astonishing overreaction. The average age of death for coronavirus victims is 83. The mortality rate seems to be as low as 0.6% in South Ko…

> The mortality rate seems to be as low as 0.6% in South Korea or as high as 5% in Italy. [...] It is not an End of Days zombie apocalypse. A few percent is a lot . World War II killed 3% of the human population, and that's where we're headed if we don't stop it.

Because World War 2 killed 3% of the general population.

The coronavirus, in a single country, has killed 5% of infected people and elder people or those with pre-existing conditions are majorly overrepresented in infection rates.

>World War II killed 3% of the human population, and that's where we're headed if we don't stop it.

This isn't just wrong. It's irresponsible for you to be saying these types of absolutely incorrect things.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#109

Post by Frost1x »

unlinked_dll wrote: post #30

Regardless of the ability of people to travel to the UK or Canada and get here (which people have done for a long time with other nations we don't take kindly to) it's absolutely going to reduce the number of people who will travel across the pond. Which is the goal, reduce infection rates. My concern is how economies are going to respond to the US being cut off from Continental ports for a month, which as far as I c…

>Which is the goal, reduce infection rates.

Based on the localized infection cases I see across the US and have been watching as well as the characteristics of the virus (life outside host/on surfaces, in air, the degree of asymptomatic transference, etc.), it's well beyond containment IMHO.

Travel isn't going to do too much to reduce infection rates alone. We need significant cultural changes to reduce infection rates, but I don't see that happening for a variety of reasons. This country isn't about proactive action and is all about reactionary action though, so we're just waiting for that reactionary threshold. Some preventative measures have been pushed but they're no where near aggressive enough at this point.

It will be interesting how this is handled in our modern cultural, current political and work culture, etc. I suspect it's going to be fairly nasty but certainly hope not. I've been advising my parents to stock up and minimize any outside interactions for awhile.

Re: U.S. will suspend all travel from Europe for 30 days

#110

Post by chasd00 »

wpietri wrote: post #77
refurb wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all about flattening the curve at this point. You can do your best to identify those infected and have them self-quarantine, but if the gates are open and infected people are streaming into your country, you're not going to get far.

But doesn't that require the notion that infection rates are higher in the excluded place? Given the US's incredible failure to test widely, I am not seeing why flights from Sweden or Ireland are any more dangerous than flights from Seattle at this point.

I have to agree. you may as well ground all flights at this point.
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