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We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

meshtastic.org

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Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#151

Post by punkgeek »

myself248 wrote: post #135
punkgeek wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, that's what we thought also. Also, the phone is optional for our case (though you need it for sending texts - if you don't have one the display still shows rxed texts and headings/distance to members of the channel)

In my case, only the Heltec boards were easily available, and they lack the GPS that's in the TTgo boards. So I hope there's a way for the phone's GPS to participate! (Or, since the esp32 has bluetooth, recognize a bluetooth GPS puck? That's extra work and they're quite rare, so maybe nah.) Otherwise I'm totally fine soldering another GPS onto some random GPIO pins, I have a whole bag of those. I'm just not sure what…

yes. If your radio doesn't have GPS the phone will provide GPS updates to the radio. Everything is treated identially (though there will be a bit higher battery consumption on both the phone and the radio)

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#152

Post by punkgeek »

myself248 wrote: post #135
punkgeek wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, that's what we thought also. Also, the phone is optional for our case (though you need it for sending texts - if you don't have one the display still shows rxed texts and headings/distance to members of the channel)

In my case, only the Heltec boards were easily available, and they lack the GPS that's in the TTgo boards. So I hope there's a way for the phone's GPS to participate! (Or, since the esp32 has bluetooth, recognize a bluetooth GPS puck? That's extra work and they're quite rare, so maybe nah.) Otherwise I'm totally fine soldering another GPS onto some random GPIO pins, I have a whole bag of those. I'm just not sure what…

also, adding support to dynamically probe for a GPS attached to GPIOs would be very straightforward (almost identical to the tbeam case). If you're interested in this ping us on the devchat and someone will help talk you through it.

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#153

Post by jesse_m »

punkgeek wrote: post #144
linuxguy2 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I checked out the page you linked and it doesn't load very well. FYI * No http -> https redirect * Broken layout when forced to https * Play store link 404's * Icon on the download button is broken

really - on www.meshtastic.org? It is just a standard github pages page. I think you might want to check your web browser config.

I think he's talking to the serval mesh guy

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#154

Post by jsilence »

gardners wrote: post #70

Howdy, as the founder of the Serval Mesh adhoc networking protocols and hardware, what I would look for in a new radio is: 1. True packet radio mode, that doesn't hide the radioness of the link etc, but lets the programmer use it's strengths. 2. UART link, ideally using 3DR/RFD900 compatible connector (then we can include it directly in our existing systems, and so can others). 3. Field-flashable, but with robust pro…

Awesome advice!

Would love to know what you consider better than chirped spread spectrum.

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#155

Post by vkaku »

Make the mesh affordable, keep making the drivers and interfaces clean and reasonably easy to maintain.

In mass adoption, you want to keep the price right - so have a bulk pricing upfront. Also, keep one access protocol you can access from a phone / PC / most popular devices.

You're doing everything right. Try to get one great customer who can benefit from this today.

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#156

Post by ruslan »

luma wrote: post #137
ruslan wrote: post #121

I'm just curious why my comment regarding patent was deleted ? Yes we developed a device that implements this same idea of sharing GPS data over mesh (868 ISM) network and patented it in 2014. The patent is still valid and supported. If someone is interested in further development of this idea, please contact me, we would be happy to sell this patent along with schematics and source codes for fair price.

Your post said nothing about the patent itself, and simply stated that this open source project should be paying you. It's not exactly the best approach on a site like this. How about outlining the specific patent claims you feel are being violated here, along with links to the patents in question? That approach would feel a lot more helpful and a lot less like a shakedown. If you've somehow managed to get a patent o…

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a patent troll, neither I want to sue anyone - that is against my attutude (I consider myself an old time hacker rooting from late 80s :)). I'm just a co-developer and co-holder of the patent for a device that does, among other things, exactly what topic starter described. We began developing it back in 2011 and proceeded for several years, we had been spending our free time and "pocket" money on it. In case you are interested it took us to route and assemble 22 versions of PCB prototype of the main board and 5 prototypes of a radio. We even exhibited it at one of the electronics show in Moscow. As we failed to find sufficient investment to push it to the market, we decided to freeze the project in 2015. In my initial comment that was silently and shamefully deleted, I proposed to aquire our patent, that's what might have any value today, as schematics and hardware are all outdated. As mentioned above, discussing patent details on public is not any good idea, that is why I simply pointed that I can be contacted on these matters.

I understand that hackers are strictly opposed to any sort of patents or copyright. But it is not avoidable topic once you are into business of settling or growing your own company (or a startup). And this is a startup place, isn't it ?

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#157

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

punkgeek wrote: post #149
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #89

I’m interested, but we’ll see how it goes. This is a non-trivial endeavor. I’ve been trying to write an open-source Apple driver for goTenna units, and have been unable to get them to help me out by providing their BLE spec. That’s a shame, because I write really nice SDKs. Even if my driver was open and free, it would provide significant brand reinforcement. Win-win. I believe that this tech is important, as it can…

The current alpha works pretty well. (I'm sort of retired now, but my old job included writing software for these sorts of radios). If you'd like to play with this project we'd love your help (and we have a documented ble api). Here's an issue where various iOS types are ideating on possibly making an iOS app: https://github.com/meshtastic/Meshtastic-esp32/issues/14

I'll probably look at it in a few days.

I'm actually in the middle of creating a Web-based instruction series on writing Core Bluetooth SDKs for Apple platforms (not just iOS).

Once I get that done, I may look at adapting this project:

https://github.com/RiftValleySoftware/RVS_GTDriver

For it. It started as a goTenna project, but they never got around to helping me out, so I gave up on them, and made it an OBD driver.

The infrastructure is still there for all kinds of stuff, so I could probably do something.

BTW: If that works out, it would be an SDK that would afford ALL Apple platforms; including Watch and TV.

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#158

Post by luma »

ruslan wrote: post #156
luma wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your post said nothing about the patent itself, and simply stated that this open source project should be paying you. It's not exactly the best approach on a site like this. How about outlining the specific patent claims you feel are being violated here, along with links to the patents in question? That approach would feel a lot more helpful and a lot less like a shakedown. If you've somehow managed to get a patent o…

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a patent troll, neither I want to sue anyone - that is against my attutude (I consider myself an old time hacker rooting from late 80s :)). I'm just a co-developer and co-holder of the patent for a device that does, among other things, exactly what topic starter described. We began developing it back in 2011 and proceeded for several years, we had been spending our free time and "pocket" m…

You sound like a reasonable person and I have every reason to believe you’re acting in good faith. Your website suggests a patent pending in Russia. I am completely unfamiliar with Russian IP law which might be the source of my misunderstanding. Having said that, is there a reason you won’t provide the specific patent(s) in question? I would presume they are a matter of public record when they were issued.

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#159

Post by ruslan »

luma wrote: post #158
ruslan wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a patent troll, neither I want to sue anyone - that is against my attutude (I consider myself an old time hacker rooting from late 80s :)). I'm just a co-developer and co-holder of the patent for a device that does, among other things, exactly what topic starter described. We began developing it back in 2011 and proceeded for several years, we had been spending our free time and "pocket" m…

You sound like a reasonable person and I have every reason to believe you’re acting in good faith. Your website suggests a patent pending in Russia. I am completely unfamiliar with Russian IP law which might be the source of my misunderstanding. Having said that, is there a reason you won’t provide the specific patent(s) in question? I would presume they are a matter of public record when they were issued.

The site had not been updated when the patent issued, sorry about that. Patent # RU 2559714. Exchanging GPS data is just a part of the device, btw.

Re: We're making an open-source $30 GPS/mesh radio, would like advice

#160

Post by glassuser »

kawfey wrote: post #122
punkgeek wrote: post #2

Hi ya'll, so we've spent a few weeks making device software and an android app to convert a $30 chinese gps/radio into a long range mesh radio for hikers. It is working fairly well now (though still an alpha) and we'd love more people to try it and/or have fun coding on it. We got about 30 users (and some devs from this hackaday article) but we'd love more users and devs to join this happy-happy project: https://hack…

Radio amateurs might be some suitable beta testers for you. It being an open source radio system fits right into the mission and spirit of amateur radio. However, I'll take the cynical route and say mesh radios, for the general public, are still not very popular. Gotenna and Beartooth, among others appear to be common and popular, and highly reviewed, but in my hikes and ski trips, I haven't seen or heard from a sing…

I'm one of those amateurs.

Gotenna is stupid expensive. And spot is pretty evil (or at least the instances I've encountered it).

I think what most of the public expects from a radio device is PTT audio. Which isn't going to work with these low bitrate lora devices. I think if they got conditioned to some of this form factor, it would catch on a lot better.

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