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MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

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Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#251

Post by chris11 »

komali2 wrote: post #227
kyeb wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In what way are dorms worse than personal homes for diseases anyway? Are they not trusting their students to prepare their own food? Why don't they just close the dining halls instead? The dorms have shared bathrooms, often shared rooms with doubles, triples, and quads, and shared living spaces (lounges, study rooms, laundry, etc.) in addition to the dining halls. Moreover, in our dorms, we have effectively no way t…

Ok, so a population that is majority not at-risk and extraordinarily self-contained is going to be instead distributed into the wider population en masse? Seems insane.

I think most students would be more self-contained off-campus. Going entirely online helps, but I wouldn't call college downs clean. Clearing them out is a good idea.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#252

Post by akiselev »

komali2 wrote: post #227
kyeb wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In what way are dorms worse than personal homes for diseases anyway? Are they not trusting their students to prepare their own food? Why don't they just close the dining halls instead? The dorms have shared bathrooms, often shared rooms with doubles, triples, and quads, and shared living spaces (lounges, study rooms, laundry, etc.) in addition to the dining halls. Moreover, in our dorms, we have effectively no way t…

Ok, so a population that is majority not at-risk and extraordinarily self-contained is going to be instead distributed into the wider population en masse? Seems insane.

MIT is not "self contained," it's in the middle of the Boston metro less than a few miles away from dozens of other schools including large universities like BU and Harvard.

The university can send most of its students home. It can't stop the rest of the world from interacting with them in the middle of a regional hub.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#254

Post by thulecitizen »

nostrademons wrote: post #175
thulecitizen wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me what you write are great arguments for tuition free universities, like the ones in Sweden. It makes society much more equitable and egalitarian. This whole artificial scarcity thing is such a lose-lose for everyone in society.

To me it highlights one of the big failings of markets, which is that a tool/credential/innovation only has economic value if it's used by some but not all producers in the market. Once it becomes universally adopted it becomes an opportunity for rent-seeking by the producer of that tool/credential/innovation. In some ways this is the great strength of capitalism, because it provides an incentive to adopt innovations…

Agreed.

Have you read any Guy Standing?

“ …today, a tiny minority of people and corporate interests across the world are accumulating vast wealth and power from rental income, not only from housing and land but from a range of other assets, natural and created. ‘Rentiers’ of all kinds are in unparalleled ascendancy and the neo-liberal state is only too keen to oblige their greed.

Rentiers derive income from ownership, possession or control of assets that are scarce or artificially made scarce. Most familiar is rental income from land, property, mineral exploitation or financial investments, but other sources have grown too. They include the income lenders gain from debt interest; income from ownership of ‘intellectual property’ (such as patents, copyright, brands and trademarks); capital gains on investments; ‘above normal’ company profits (when a firm has a dominant market position that allows it to charge high prices or dictate terms); income from government subsidies; and income of financial and other intermediaries derived from third-party transactions.”

What are some of your go to authors, areas of interest? Or in other words, who are you grateful for, for their influence on you?

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#255

Post by mauvehaus »

rsynnott wrote: post #249
iokanuon wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Moreover, in our dorms, we have effectively no way to eat if the dining halls close down. That sounds crazy to me, in Poland there's a multitude of cheap restaurants full of students close to every university campus. There's a big demand because universities are packed with students that don't cook for themselves. Why hasn't the same happened to the US then?

American universities are often basically in the middle of nowhere.

MIT is most assuredly not:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Great+Dome/@42.3615,-71.10...

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#256

Post by newtoday »

ComputerGuru wrote: post #192

The focus has all been on colleges and universities announcing that they're closing face-face-instruction for the month/quarter/semester but we're scrambling trying to find something that works for K-12 schools. * Students at the college level can be counted on to self-study /to an extent/ if you make accommodations and provide the resources they need * Internet access can be taken for granted when dealing with colle…

Yep, this. The US public school system is in no way prepared for remote education, or any solution to supplement the impact we're facing.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#257

Post by Gibbon1 »

xur17 wrote: post #193
Trasmatta wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The goal at this point should be to flatten the curve as much as possible to prevent overwhelming healthcare until a vaccine is developed and tested. Nobody thinks this is going to be a permanent measure.

I don't disagree with the flattening the curve bit, but I do wonder - my understanding is that a vaccine is at minimum a year out. Would we need to keep doing this for that entire time period, or are there other factors at play here?

I think that there is a rough relation between the infection rate and the percent of the population that gets infected.

Consider raw r0 of 3.0. Each case infects three other people. But as more and more of the population gets infected and acquires immunity the infection rate drops. Say half the population is immune due to prior infection. The rate is now half r0 = 3.0 * 0.5 Left unchecked 66% of the population will get infected and then the disease dies out.

Social distancing, hand washing, quarantine reduces r0. And reduces the total number that the virus can infect before is dies out. Cut r0 from 3.0 to 1.5 and the number of infected goes from 66% to 33%.

In the US that would be 100 million people. And maybe a million fewer deaths.

Scuttlebutt is China and Taiwan due to high early compliance have r0 down to about 0.3, which means the epidemic is in a state of exponential crash.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#258

Post by porknubbins »

CydeWeys wrote: post #233
kyeb wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The closest grocery is Target in Central square, which is extremely limited or maybe Trader Joe's, which also isn't the same. The Star Market that was right behind campus closed a couple years ago. It's not so easy, in my opinion.

That Target is less than a mile from all of campus, and a quarter mile from the closest dorms. That's easy walking distance. What am I missing?

I’ve seen like most of Boston on a bike share under an hour. There is zero reason students in a dense major city couldn’t buy groceries.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#259

Post by perennate »

nemothekid wrote: post #250
CydeWeys wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty of fast food places/corner stores/restaurants/groceries in Cambridge within walking distance of MIT dorms. So the "no way to eat" part is a bit dramatic.

I don’t know how much dining hall food costs or if it’s prepaid but you are talking about eating out for every meal on a students budget. The point about bringing up the dining hall is they can’t go to the grocery store because they have no way to cook (and maybe even store) the food they bought.

Ha, the prices are at [1], the cheapest is around $13 per meal. Eating out can be much cheaper, and there are healthy options.

[1] https://studentlife.mit.edu/dining/residential-dining/meal-p...

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#260

Post by slg »

CydeWeys wrote: post #209
iokanuon wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Moreover, in our dorms, we have effectively no way to eat if the dining halls close down. That sounds crazy to me, in Poland there's a multitude of cheap restaurants full of students close to every university campus. There's a big demand because universities are packed with students that don't cook for themselves. Why hasn't the same happened to the US then?

There are plenty of fast food places/corner stores/restaurants/groceries in Cambridge within walking distance of MIT dorms. So the "no way to eat" part is a bit dramatic.

There is "no way to eat [while remaining quarantined]".

Dorms do not have private kitchens. They don't even have private sinks. I'm not familiar with MIT specifically, but the most you can usually hope for in the average American dorm room is a mini-fridge and a microwave. It would be incredibly difficult to expect a large number of people to live in those conditions for multiple weeks if quarantined.

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