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MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

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Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#171

Post by greedo »

chickenpotpie wrote: post #112
jacquesm wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the typical age of MIT professors? What's the typical age of the students parents? What would happen if a good 5% of them have more than a runny nose, end up in intensive care and there is a shortage of beds? Go read up for a bit on what is happening in Italy, then check where your country is and advance 4 weeks. See if you still think 'runny noses' is a good analogy.

I don't know if it's fair to compare MIT to Italy. Italy has a very aging population and MIT is very young and Boston has some of the best healthcare in the country.

And Italy has some of the best healthcare in the world. When you have only so many ICU beds and ventilators, it doesn't matter.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#172

Post by saagarjha »

chickenpotpie wrote: post #164
saagarjha wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would they know if you're done with finals?

You had to share your final schedule with them.

What's stopping you from lying and saying that all your classes have finals on Friday? It seems kind of stupid that they'll deprive you of a dorm you paid for because of how your schedule is laid out…

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#173

Post by whymauri »

jacquesm wrote: post #108
whymauri wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm by no means an expert, but... Is it a good idea to send a campus of young potential carriers from an emergency zone [0] to the rest of the nation, if not the world? MIT and Harvard may be setting a precedent in the world's largest college town that the status quo is to send thousands of travelers from a disease epicenter to lesser-affected areas. I'm genuinely concerned - not for my health as a student, but for h…

They're not potential carriers. They are potential future problems and concentrating so many people that are so mobile is currently a very large risk. Right now the chances of many of them being infected are still relatively low. Give it a few weeks and it is pretty much a certainty.

After some reading, I've become slightly more sympathetic to the theory that flattening the curve via early dispersion is a good idea since students would have to travel anyways in May.

That said, I really do believe there could be several potential carriers on campus. Here are some reasons why:

(1) There were still large events and gatherings, like the Bitcoin Expo.

(2) Especially notable, large lectures were not canceled until very recently.

(3) Testing has been incredibly hard to do via campus medical services. If cases are identified later, I'd imagine it'd be under-reported since students are young and testing is hard.

(4) The carrier who was on campus a few weeks ago was in a very high-traffic building (MIT Sloan) and there was no timely warning of this.

But yes, I do actually see the merits of early dispersion now and understand the point you're getting across.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#174

Post by fzeroracer »

jacquesm wrote: post #104
atomicUpdate wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> vs the chaos that could entail if they didn't A campus full of runny noses for a couple weeks? These are overwhelmingly young people of which the vast majority would be perfectly fine.

What's the typical age of MIT professors? What's the typical age of the students parents? What would happen if a good 5% of them have more than a runny nose, end up in intensive care and there is a shortage of beds? Go read up for a bit on what is happening in Italy, then check where your country is and advance 4 weeks. See if you still think 'runny noses' is a good analogy.

You don't see the irony in sending students home to their parents when some of them might be asymptomatic, right? Or if they catch it during travel?

The correct method of action here is to tell professors to stay home and students to stay put. Not to tell students to leave and travel! That's absolute madness.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#175

Post by nostrademons »

thulecitizen wrote: post #111
nostrademons wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If there is no refund being offered for the content shifting online from in-person, why have in-person at all? There isn't really a good reason other than some people being more disciplined when there's a human instructor that they see face to face every couple days. Plenty of people self-teach from MOOCs, MIT OCW, or just buying the textbooks and working through the exercises and get just as good an education. Whe…

To me what you write are great arguments for tuition free universities, like the ones in Sweden. It makes society much more equitable and egalitarian. This whole artificial scarcity thing is such a lose-lose for everyone in society.

To me it highlights one of the big failings of markets, which is that a tool/credential/innovation only has economic value if it's used by some but not all producers in the market. Once it becomes universally adopted it becomes an opportunity for rent-seeking by the producer of that tool/credential/innovation.

In some ways this is the great strength of capitalism, because it provides an incentive to adopt innovations that helps overcome the status-quo bias that most humans have. But it also encourages firms to restrict access to their suppliers and tear their competitors down rather than building everybody up.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#176

Post by roel_v »

chickenpotpie wrote: post #112
jacquesm wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the typical age of MIT professors? What's the typical age of the students parents? What would happen if a good 5% of them have more than a runny nose, end up in intensive care and there is a shortage of beds? Go read up for a bit on what is happening in Italy, then check where your country is and advance 4 weeks. See if you still think 'runny noses' is a good analogy.

I don't know if it's fair to compare MIT to Italy. Italy has a very aging population and MIT is very young and Boston has some of the best healthcare in the country.

"and Boston has some of the best healthcare in the country."

I hear people say that all the time of all sorts of places, but what does that mean? Does Boston have (beyond some baseline) more respiratory aid machines than other places? More virus or respiratory system specialists? Better or more nurses? If they do, why? It doesn't matter if they have a bunch of world class brain surgeons. I'd imagine the area would have roughly the same level of materials and skills in this specific domain that other big developed areas have. I wonder what makes people so sure about the specific capabilities of all the areas they claim to be (much) better than other areas.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#177

Post by ryeights »

generationP wrote: post #144

> Undergraduates who live in an MIT residence or fraternity, sorority or independent living group (FSILG) must begin packing and departing this Saturday, March 14. We are requiring undergraduates to depart from campus residences no later than noon on Tuesday, March 17. This is strange. Isn't the travel they are forcing quite possibly a cure worse than the disease? And are they really expecting students (many of them…

>This is strange. Isn't the travel they are forcing quite possibly a cure worth than the disease?

Many (most?) students already travel for spring break, so this shouldn't result in much more travel than usual. I imagine that is what motivated their timing on this.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#178

Post by c0rtex »

ptero wrote: post #155

I am not a doctor but I honestly do not see why the current state warrants such drastic actions. Is it, objectively, so much worse than usual seasonal flu epidemics? An honest question, any scientific/quantitative pointers appreciated!

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-compared-to-flu-...

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#179

Post by buckminster »

Keverw wrote: post #149
chickenpotpie wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get it either. It was especially irritating at my university because the dorms were several thousand dollars a semester more expensive than larger, better apartments nearby, but they were the worst landlords I ever had. They would kick me out all the time, while still charging me rent. During finals week you had to be gone within 24 hours of taking your last final or be fined. If schools in the US aren't goin…

Be fined? Is that in a contract? Seems odd with private companies being able to fine people.

Regular rentals can "fine" you by retaining the deposit. It used to be the case that universities in the UK would withhold your degree until you paid all fines and charges. I think this was only stopped in the last couple of years.

Re: MIT moves all classes online for the rest of the semester

#180

Post by rellui »

smallgovt wrote: post #94
PureParadigm wrote: post #50

I think large decisive moves like this may seem to some to be an overreaction, but it will prove to be the correct decision in hindsight (like the early travel bans). Exponential growth is real, and anything we can do to slow the rate of infection will save lives. As a current undergrad at UC Berkeley, they've moved all classes here online [1], and exams are either being postponed or converted to take-home assignment…

Actually, I think it's likely going to be seen as an overreaction in hindsight by the general public (even though it may not be). If these actions are successful in curbing the virus' spread, most people won't appreciate how bad things could have really gotten.

In this case though we've examples of how bad it can get. Iran comes to mind. As this progresses we'll see what happens to countries who didn't attempt any quarantine or drastic measures at all.
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