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Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

emissionsanalytics.com

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Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#231

Post by reitzensteinm »

jessaustin wrote: post #203
masklinn wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Truck driver. Not quibbling, just adding nuance. You're absolutely quibbling though. > So you should include in your calculations that the load is spread out over eighteen tires, as above. The fourth power rule is specifically about axle load, not about wheel load. It's also an estimate / rule of thumb (which is why it's so useful), not a precision instrument. But hey if you want more precision than the FPR we can…

Yeah, they use dual tires so that they don't pop catastrophically, not to spare the road from wear.

I'm sure that's true, but are you saying it doesn't reduce wear?

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#232

Post by bryanmgreen »

harimau777 wrote: post #227
bryanmgreen wrote: post #216

All these articles are important, but they end up missing the point of the auto industries weightiest concern. At the end of the day, it really comes down to the weight of the vehicles. There is absolutely zero justification for any standard-use car to weigh more than 3,200 pounds, and that's for a SUV. More weight affects EVERYTHING. Material logistics/sourcing/shipping/construction costs and emissions/waste-disposa…

Isn't one of the biggest reasons to drive a very large car safety? Unless everyone starts driving light weight cars, it seems to me that anyone who does would be putting themselves at risk in the case of an accident.

I think that's mostly a marketing pitch and an outdated one at that. Safety tech has come a very long way.

It is true, but only marginally and mostly at very high speed, heavy impact collisions.

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#233

Post by Spooky23 »

selectodude wrote: post #142
Spooky23 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shitty tires start with the same tread depth, but wear out in 25-35k miles. High quality tires usually go 50-60k.

The $400/corner tires on a sports car usually last about 5-8000 miles. They’re about as high quality as it gets.

I’m talking more the $60 on sale tires at pep boys.

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#234

Post by loeg »

saiya-jin wrote: post #222
kungtotte wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're torn up from the road and rubbed off from the tyres themselves. The majority is obviously coming from the road. There's been studies done here in Sweden since we've banned studded winter tyres in some areas of Stockholm in an effort to reduce road wear and improve air quality. I don't know of any sources in English off the top of my head though. The last time I read an article about it though (2+ years ago, d…

That doesn't make sense to me either. Take a busy German highway (as I don't know the average load on US ones), easily 100k cars per day. There are parts of highways which don't get replaced for 20 years easily. Plus apart from tiny fraction of north europe (and maybe Canada?), nobody ever uses studs. Back of the envelope math tells me 1 km of highway would lose some 730 tonnes of asphalt, per year (so 14,600 tonnes…

People use studded tires the US, too.

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#235

Post by gambiting »

gentleman11 wrote: post #198
kungtotte wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're torn up from the road and rubbed off from the tyres themselves. The majority is obviously coming from the road. There's been studies done here in Sweden since we've banned studded winter tyres in some areas of Stockholm in an effort to reduce road wear and improve air quality. I don't know of any sources in English off the top of my head though. The last time I read an article about it though (2+ years ago, d…

I have been wearing studded slip on crampons when walking my dog this winter. The ice has been ridiculous, I’ve fallen twice already when not wearing them. Not great for the sidewalks, I know, but the dog needs his walks or he would... get sad

I cannot believe a studded shoe would have any impact whatsoever on a concrete pavement. Human weight is nothing compared to that of a car.

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#237

Post by masklinn »

reitzensteinm wrote: post #231
jessaustin wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, they use dual tires so that they don't pop catastrophically, not to spare the road from wear.

I'm sure that's true, but are you saying it doesn't reduce wear?

I'm sure it reduces wear on the tires.

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#238

Post by labawi »

kungtotte wrote: post #173
ratel wrote: post #164

Hold on: The claim is this: > "Using a popular family hatchback running on brand new, correctly inflated tyres, we found that the car emitted 5.8 grams per kilometer of particles." It does not seem to be a mistake: > "Compared with regulated exhaust emission limits of 4.5 milligrams per kilometer, the completely unregulated tyre wear emission is higher by a factor of over 1,000." A tire might way up to 15 kilograms f…

They're torn up from the road and rubbed off from the tyres themselves. The majority is obviously coming from the road. There's been studies done here in Sweden since we've banned studded winter tyres in some areas of Stockholm in an effort to reduce road wear and improve air quality. I don't know of any sources in English off the top of my head though. The last time I read an article about it though (2+ years ago, d…

Study mentions EU and source company has offices in Stokenchurch, UK and Stuttgart, Germany. I doubt they tested with studded tires and called it typical.

They did test with brand new tires - that's the likely source.

"Emissions Analytics .. [self proclaimed?] leading independent .. specialist for .. measurement of realworld emissions .. performed .. initial tyre wear testing. .. on brand new, correctly inflated tyres .. [and] found that the car emitted 5.8 grams per kilometer of particles."

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#239

Post by hef19898 »

abyssin wrote: post #37
_Microft wrote: post #32

Maybe offtopic but a surprising bit of extra information regarding wear and vehicles: Road wear scales with the fourth power of axle load, so heavier vehicles do much more damage than one might expect. Take a 40t truck with 5 axles vs. a small car with a weight of 1t and two axles (e.g. VW Polo, maybe an older VW Golf might only weigh 1t as well): (8t axle load / 0.5t axle load) = 16^4, i.e. the truck puts 2^16 (6553…

I remember a hitchhiking ride in France with a man working in the building and infrastructure industry telling me about these figures, and the intense lobbying against transporting goods on rails...

On Germany the best lobby work to put transportation on truck instead of rail is done by DB, German Railroads, with their freight services. Compared to trucking you can easily double lead times, increase costs per ton and decrease trackability and reliability.

Re: Pollution from tire wear is worse than exhaust emissions?

#240

Post by totalZero »

Tires contain fossil fuel products like carbon black and synthetic rubber.

The roadway contains bitumen, another fossil fuel product.

The numbers in this experiment seem dubious and are probably not representative, but they do reflect our over-dependence on refined petroleum. We have to find new ways to make these things.

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