Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020 • Hacker News Board

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#81

Post by drdaeman » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 12:51 AM UTC

quintushoratius wrote: post #76

p1mrx wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What actually is a 4to6 gateway? For example, how would an IPv4 client connect to a 128-bit address like 2606:4700:20::6819:6c0d?

You contract with a tunnel broker (most, if not all, are free) to give you an address. If you have a lan then you can set up radvd (or similar) to distribute addresses. You may need to replace your router though. Your ipv6 packets head out over a 4to6 tunnel to your broker, and then out to the wider world.

Nah, that's not the problem/solution, not in the ISP context. It's trivial for most ISPs (unless they have ton of ancient hardware and neglected to upgrade, or if they have very poor and limited peering options) to obtain an IPv6 block and set it up on their backbone network.

All the complexity is about providing this to the end users. Depending on your tech stack, you may have no issues, or you may need to replace just about everything (NASes, accounting/billing system, etc - whatever pieces were built with IPv4-only in mind)

Source: I worked for an ISP a while ago. We got our servers IPv6 connectivity, in, like, a day. We haven't solved IPv6 end-user connectivity (but it really wasn't a priority then), although was we had a few experimental connections - with lots of duct tape and random end-user issues whenever something was misconfigured (e.g. at the time not every site's AAAA record was actually responding, despite the existence).

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#82

Post by grawprog » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 1:00 AM UTC

londons_explore wrote: post #44

bsanr2 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This might be one of those "it's a feature, not a bug" dealies. Software is now subject to similar rules of decay and planned obsolescence as hardware and material objects. Guess you just have to go buy a new one under whatever pay structure is the current paradigm.

Except the vast majority of material objects don't decay, or at least don't decay quickly. The hoe I use for de-weeding my garden was my great grandfathers, and is probably 100 years old. It functions pretty much the same as it did when it was new. My father had to put one new screw in it I remember, so it has served its purpose continuously for 100 years with ~20 minutes of maintenance. A similar small bit of softwa…

>for 100 years with ~20 minutes of maintenance.

While I get your point, are you honestly saying a hoe has lasted 100 years and still completely usable to its original standards with absolutely no sharpening, oiling, cleaning or care of any kind other than changing a screw?

Stainless steel wasn't exactly common back then, so I'm assuming this hoe was probably iron with a wooden handle?

The iron would definitely need to be at least cleaned and dried after use to prevent corrosion and the handle, while probably at least treated at one point, would likely need some kind of maintenance, even if just cleaning, to prevent rot and decay?

After 100 years not even a single nick in the blade that needed to be honed out? Never hit a single rock with it? Tree roots never dulled it?

Sorry, I know I'm being kind of facetious, but manual tools definitely need care and maintenance if they're used regularly. Even simple ones.

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#83

Post by m-p-3 » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 1:13 AM UTC

olyjohn wrote: post #63

diebeforei485 wrote: post #59

So, Philips Hue users need a new $60 bridge after 8 years? That actually seems reasonable to me. 8 years is longer support than most other devices.

Better than I would have expected... and it still works locally. This means you can probably still connect it up to another automation system of some sort. Maybe I'm the only one who doesn't care, because I don't use the cloud features anyways... I mean most cloud-connected devices don't even have an option for local management, and just become a brick when the cloud service goes down.

I'm kinda okay with this, as long as I can interconnect my stuff with open platforms. Sure, most users want something that Just Works™ and that's what sells, but the market has no real de facto standards so things are bound to change and get discontinued. I just want something that I can fully control, but it implies some work and planning.

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#84

Post by ViViDboarder » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 1:14 AM UTC

donatj wrote: post #68

4rt wrote: post #66

my problem with being too critical of this is that hue is very open, very well documented and nothing else is. declaring that you'll never buy another philips product ever again because they shut off hosted services support for a relatively flawed v1 device -- when a v2 device is available for £25 -- is pretty petulant imo. it will still work on your lan. i've got 15 hue bulbs and a hue bridge but i don't use any of…

Lifx has an entirely open and very well documented local UDP API, and a pretty open and well documented REST API. On top of that, no need for a bridge or base station. They can operate entirely locally with no need for a mother ship if you don't need to control them away from home. I make pretty heavy use of the UDP API from my local server and help maintain a Go library.

Those are WiFi though, no? Not exactly the same thing. Personally, I prefer a hub/bridge and then a mesh network for Home Automation. I’ve got Hue, Z-Wave, and WeMo. I much prefer the experience with the first two now.

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#85

Post by ViViDboarder » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 1:15 AM UTC

olyjohn wrote: post #63

diebeforei485 wrote: post #59

So, Philips Hue users need a new $60 bridge after 8 years? That actually seems reasonable to me. 8 years is longer support than most other devices.

Better than I would have expected... and it still works locally. This means you can probably still connect it up to another automation system of some sort. Maybe I'm the only one who doesn't care, because I don't use the cloud features anyways... I mean most cloud-connected devices don't even have an option for local management, and just become a brick when the cloud service goes down.

Yep. I imagine Home Assistant will still work just fine with it.

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#86

Post by jedieaston » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 1:19 AM UTC

kozak wrote: post #15

I need to buy a new TV, and I'm desperately looking for a "dumb" one. I just need a HDMI input and that's it.

https://www.cdw.com/search/?key=hospitality%20tv&searchscope...

These are TVs with the smart stuff removed for use in enterprise/hotels that don't want it. Pick your favorite!

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#87

Post by drdaeman » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 1:20 AM UTC

orev wrote: post #40

swiley wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smart isn’t the bad part, it’s closed source firmware that causes these (and other) problems.

No, it’s the insistence on using the Cloud for things that could easily be done on-premises.

But those bridges are exactly that, aren't they?

They're locally running servers, doing all things on premises. My only issue with Philips is that I'd love to have an SDK to run my own code on the bridge (which is possible, though, but in unofficial way).

I guess if all this third-party stuff in the cloud (which are going to break because of the API shutdown = external connectivity/tunnel shutdown) would be apps, downloadable to the bridge instead, things would be better...

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#88

Post by userbinator » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 2:56 AM UTC

grawprog wrote: post #82

londons_explore wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the vast majority of material objects don't decay, or at least don't decay quickly. The hoe I use for de-weeding my garden was my great grandfathers, and is probably 100 years old. It functions pretty much the same as it did when it was new. My father had to put one new screw in it I remember, so it has served its purpose continuously for 100 years with ~20 minutes of maintenance. A similar small bit of softwa…

>for 100 years with ~20 minutes of maintenance. While I get your point, are you honestly saying a hoe has lasted 100 years and still completely usable to its original standards with absolutely no sharpening, oiling, cleaning or care of any kind other than changing a screw? Stainless steel wasn't exactly common back then, so I'm assuming this hoe was probably iron with a wooden handle? The iron would definitely need t…

To give a better and perhaps more relevant example: The wiring and many electrical devices in my house are over half a century old, yet all the switches and outlets still function perfectly fine.

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#89

Post by mockie » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 3:06 AM UTC

4rt wrote: post #66

my problem with being too critical of this is that hue is very open, very well documented and nothing else is. declaring that you'll never buy another philips product ever again because they shut off hosted services support for a relatively flawed v1 device -- when a v2 device is available for £25 -- is pretty petulant imo. it will still work on your lan. i've got 15 hue bulbs and a hue bridge but i don't use any of…

Have you looked at IKEA's offerings? I have 5 bulbs and 3 dimmers switches + Home Assistant and am very satisfied.

https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/tradfri/

https://www.home-assistant.io/blog/2017/04/17/ikea-tradfri-i...

Re: Philips Hue Bridge v1 online services will be shut off after April 2020

#90

Post by SECProto » Sat, Mar 07, 2020, 3:07 AM UTC

diebeforei485 wrote: post #59

So, Philips Hue users need a new $60 bridge after 8 years? That actually seems reasonable to me. 8 years is longer support than most other devices.

> So, Philips Hue users need a new $60 bridge after 8 years?

Looking at the wiki [1], v2 wasn't released until October 2015, and presumably v1 remained on some shelves for a couple months after that. So more like they need a new $60 bridge after 4 years.

This bothers me about phone updates - my manufacturer provides "two major version updates" - but in the case of my particular phone, it launched one version behind mainline, received the first update couple weeks after launch, I bought it when it was almost a year old because of the release cycle, and got the "second" update two weeks after purchase. They followed their update policy, but still leaves the public hanging.

All that said, I wouldn't buy smart lights anyway, and this situation doesn't bother me and seems like a somewhat reasonable timeline, since it doesn't totally break their functionality.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philips_Hue