Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019) • Hacker News Board

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#421

Post by thu2111 » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 12:52 PM UTC

kunglao wrote: post #352

stiray wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just an interesting idea, if no one wants to have employees (lets face it, they are a mess, they waste oxygen, they fart, producing CO2, are corona virus friendly, produce road accidents... and you need to pay them so they can live) maybe everyone is having wrong bussiness plan. Whole world should transform to produce only SAAS products for SAAS people as they are the only customers who will in long term still have m…

Hmm, there are many companies where what you proposed make sense. But there are also many that I think it's hard to debate that SaaS doesn't offer value. Running the mail server is simple enough, but then you need to set up storage. Emails are sensitive and often can't afford to lose. Then you need to set up backs, monitor and regularly test DR scenarios to see if your failovers, recovery plans are operational. Of co…

But this work scales better than linearly. One sysadmin, if doing their job properly, can configure a robust backup solution once and it will apply to many different programs. Machines in a DC can be set up once and host many programs.

Login is surely one of the best arguments for non-SaaS solutions. SSO is a total mess in the SaaS world. Everyone ends up with a billion passwords that they manage individually, change at different times, have to use a password manager to keep track of (but they all use different ones), etc. Active Directory is actually a solution to that which got lost in the move to SaaS-in-the-cloud.

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#422

Post by CrazyStat » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 12:53 PM UTC

Silhouette wrote: post #403

Serow225 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of engineering software does. FPGA toolchains, CAD, simulation. Not uncommon.

Having worked in several related areas, but not very recently, the costs for specialist software packages were certainly much higher than people think of for basic office software, but nowhere near the scale we're talking about here. Have things truly become so crazy that five-figure annual fees for these packages are the norm? A permanent licence used to cost less per user than that! But then I suppose this is the p…

Several years ago my university was bragging about a $200 million donation the engineering school had received from several companies.

Turned out it was just several hundred seat licenses for a bunch of commercial cad, simulation etc. software, which the companies valued at about $50k/seat.

A very cheap way to donate $200 million.

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#423

Post by sswaner » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 1:00 PM UTC

analog31 wrote: post #391

analog31 wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even for a typical office worker, based on my experience at a large company, there might be 10 to 20 enterprise apps that include: * Tracking work hours * Communicating within teams * Entering and managing yearly performance reviews * Managing IT tickets * Catching spyware, phishing, etc. * Key and click logging * Personality and other screenings for job candidates * Health insurance management * Jira being used outs…

Note, this list is based on things I've read about, but I don't actually know what specific security software is typically used by a large employer.

It is a good list, I would add: * Office software (Office365 or G Suite) * Record Management and Workflow * Regulatory Reporting Management * Contract Management * Financial ledger management * Data analytics / business intelligence * Logging and monitoring, log retention * Cloud hosting * Vendor Management * Travel Planning and Expense Management * Cloud Telephony * Mobile Device Management

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#424

Post by JackPoach » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 1:01 PM UTC

Well, this is pure alarmist. There are a number of examples of SaaS services that are free and/or don't use per user pricing

1. https://www.bitrix24.com/prices/ - free plan and unlimited users for $199/mo 2. https://basecamp.com/pricing - unlimited users, tasks, projects $99/mo 3. https://www.acumatica.com/acumatica-pricing/ - unlimited users pricing.

Sure, most popular SaaS (Slack, Salesforce, Trello) do charge per user. But you can switch to Bitrix24 or Basecamp that are literally just as good as Salesforce or Trello and pay a flat fee, if you want.

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#425

Post by TuringNYC » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 1:30 PM UTC

brazzy wrote: post #406

TuringNYC wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> I would not submit myself to that kind of scrutiny or micromanagement In many cases, you may not even realize it is running.

That just makes it super extra illegal.

IANAL, but my understanding is: - lots of allowances are declared by employers in their handbooks in the US. - unless there are specific union restrictions and/or state provisions, it is probably not illegal

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#426

Post by dugmartin » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 1:34 PM UTC

osel wrote: post #413

davidajackson wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone should build a webpage that does this: 1. Enter salary of engineer. 2. Enter cost per engineer of product (subscription, one time, etc.). 3. Enter required minutes to make worth your time (setup per employee can be factored in). This may already exist, but if it doesn't it could be a useful tool for Saas companies. Something you could drop into emails to potential customers ("see how much you would save"). Wo…

Seeing as you asked, here is my attempt from an afternoon's work: https://isitworththecost.com/

Very nice job.

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#427

Post by wolco » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 1:52 PM UTC

CrazyStat wrote: post #422

Silhouette wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having worked in several related areas, but not very recently, the costs for specialist software packages were certainly much higher than people think of for basic office software, but nowhere near the scale we're talking about here. Have things truly become so crazy that five-figure annual fees for these packages are the norm? A permanent licence used to cost less per user than that! But then I suppose this is the p…

Several years ago my university was bragging about a $200 million donation the engineering school had received from several companies. Turned out it was just several hundred seat licenses for a bunch of commercial cad, simulation etc. software, which the companies valued at about $50k/seat. A very cheap way to donate $200 million.

And to write-off $200.00 million.

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#428

Post by swiley » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 1:56 PM UTC

prepend wrote: post #350

adjkant wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sheets will fit a lot of excel use cases for those not doing serious heavy lifting with it. FWIW, I'm a software engineer and our IT department actually let people opt out of Microsoft office if they weren't using it to save money, and encouraging people to use Google Docs/Sheets (as most do anyways). I'm guessing a good deal of software engineers did that but there are plenty of non-engineers that probably also did…

I am a big fan of sheets, but it is not Excel. Some of the functions are missing after all these years, not to mention charts and pivots. I think Google gave up on trying to compete with excel on features.

Meh, you should probably be using either python or an RDBMS. Most non trivial applications of excel come from a lack of IS knowledge IMO. It’s easy to do but it makes everyone around you less happy.

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#429

Post by theklub » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 1:59 PM UTC

pas wrote: post #334

theklub wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about VMware, backup software, system monitoring software, update software, remote support and meeting apps. Spam filter, Terminal server licensing. There’s more I’m forgetting

Why would any of them be per employee?

Why wouldn't it be? The size of your infrastructure depends on the amount of employees you have.

Re: Companies fret as costs soar for software subscriptions (2019)

#430

Post by p0nce » Fri, Mar 06, 2020, 2:20 PM UTC

crazygringo wrote: post #247

Look, either it's worth it or it's not. Costs may be soaring, but companies wouldn't be buying them if they weren't providing more value than they cost. But: > enterprise companies are spending an average of more than $10,000 per employee per year on software Sorry but I can't wrap my head around this. Is that really accurate? Between Office and cloud and HR/payroll and a few other tools I can imagine $1,000 /year. A…

It think the point of the article is that with SaaS, the customer invariably end up spending more than she really wanted vs purchased locally-hosted software.

Which is a big reason why there is so much SaaS in the first place, in both the consumer and professional world: the customer _forgets_ about this recurring cost.