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Waymo Via

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Re: Waymo Via

#231

Post by taway94 »

ckmiller wrote: post #41

I competed in the DARPA Urban Challenge, back in 2007. While we were watching the finalists trying to sort out the world's first fully-automated traffic jam, the conversation turned to how easy it is to manipulate these vehicles. Imagine a remote stretch of highway frequented by automated 18-wheelers. All that's required to bring the truck to a screeching halt is a bedsheet and some decent timing, at which point the…

A remote operator immediately connected with the right heuristics could easily prevent a robbery

Re: Waymo Via

#232

Post by scythe »

predictmktegirl wrote: post #210

With how much money everyone is spending, wouldn't it just be cheaper to build a private cross-country interstate where only AI drivers are allowed. Let humans drive the trucks to this interstate then let the AI take over. It seems like almost all the edge cases would be solved if you just got rid of other human drivers and let the vehicles network with one another.

The problem is that the whole point of trucks is that they can go almost anywhere. Replace that with dedicated roads and you might have cheaper unit economics or whatever but you still have a rail-like distribution network.

Re: Waymo Via

#233

Post by zdragnar »

jpadkins wrote: post #97
BigBubbleButt wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not saying robbing trucks is easy. I'm saying if I were to choose between robbing a manned truck vs an unmanned truck, I would definitely rob the unmanned truck.

why? the driver of the manned truck is going to comply just as willingly. No way they are going to put their life on the line (unless they own the cargo). The unmanned truck will cameras and video uploaded, which is stronger evidence than eye witness testimony. Also police response will be faster on unmanned (they can't call the police during the hold up, you can take the persons cell phone). No way you can stop the…

If the truck is manned, it's robbery.

If the truck is unmanned, it's burglary (or theft, since a truck isn't a building).

They typically carry different penalties, and the difference is even more stark if you happen to have anything that could be considered a weapon on you when you do it.

Re: Waymo Via

#234

Post by kortilla »

bigmattystyles wrote: post #186
notatoad wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does this sort of critique keep coming up in HN threads on autonomous vehicles? have autonomous cars really gotten so good that "what if violent criminals try to attack it" is the only criticism left? I'm pretty sure not hitting cyclists is still a much larger problem than accidentally wandering into the plot of an action movie. less interesting, i guess. theft is an insurance problem. If there's no human driver…

On top of that, I doubt any human trucker is defending their load against two humans with shotguns, and that doesn't happen today enough to make the news. If anything else, you can make it so the vehicle isn't drivable by a human (no interface) and make the cargo door super secure.

People would steal from trucks significantly more frequently if there was no risk of harm like there is with the shotgun scenario.

I had two bikes stolen that had locks at them (at different times) from my apartment in Mountain View. Theft is rampant and removing the threat of a real driver pushing back completely changes the calculus for trucks.

Re: Waymo Via

#235

Post by kortilla »

danans wrote: post #208
jpitz wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> On top of that, I doubt any human trucker is defending their load against two humans with shotguns, and that doesn't happen today enough to make the news. True, but if you aren't assaulting / endangering a driver, then the crime is lower-risk.

But if you are robbing an autonomous vehicle, you're probably going to be recorded doing it, and fleeing, which raises your risk because it leaves a pretty strong evidence trail. Yes, ski masks can be used to obscure your face, but car makes can be tracked if the getaway car has no plates. If this becomes a frequent enough issue to matter economically, then perhaps we should start looking into what incentivizes stuff…

A getaway car isn’t needed, you just amble away and walk two miles the other direction.

Re: Waymo Via

#236

Post by kortilla »

agildehaus wrote: post #217
jpitz wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> On top of that, I doubt any human trucker is defending their load against two humans with shotguns, and that doesn't happen today enough to make the news. True, but if you aren't assaulting / endangering a driver, then the crime is lower-risk.

A self-driving vehicle will have far, far more sensing than any of today's trucks. Someone will know you're robbing them the moment you start, know where you are, be able to watch the entire event as it happens, and every ounce of it will be recorded.

And none of that will matter because they will just have a video of someone in a ski mask robbing a truck and walking away.

Re: Waymo Via

#237

Post by kortilla »

VectorLock wrote: post #179
notatoad wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does this sort of critique keep coming up in HN threads on autonomous vehicles? have autonomous cars really gotten so good that "what if violent criminals try to attack it" is the only criticism left? I'm pretty sure not hitting cyclists is still a much larger problem than accidentally wandering into the plot of an action movie. less interesting, i guess. theft is an insurance problem. If there's no human driver…

Is a warehouse on wheels absolutely festooned with cameras less secure than a warehouse in the middle of nowhere?

Yes, people don’t leave warehouses without guards if there is anything of great value in them that’s easily to walk away with.

Re: Waymo Via

#238

Post by unilynx »

kortilla wrote: post #235
danans wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if you are robbing an autonomous vehicle, you're probably going to be recorded doing it, and fleeing, which raises your risk because it leaves a pretty strong evidence trail. Yes, ski masks can be used to obscure your face, but car makes can be tracked if the getaway car has no plates. If this becomes a frequent enough issue to matter economically, then perhaps we should start looking into what incentivizes stuff…

A getaway car isn’t needed, you just amble away and walk two miles the other direction.

If you just robbed a truck, are you going to carry all the contents on your back? For two miles?

Re: Waymo Via

#239

Post by agentdrtran »

predictmktegirl wrote: post #210

With how much money everyone is spending, wouldn't it just be cheaper to build a private cross-country interstate where only AI drivers are allowed. Let humans drive the trucks to this interstate then let the AI take over. It seems like almost all the edge cases would be solved if you just got rid of other human drivers and let the vehicles network with one another.

you could even put down tracks for the cars to go on so they could reach higher speeds, and chain them together for efficiency. almost like some kind of train!

Re: Waymo Via

#240

Post by dcgudeman »

predictmktegirl wrote: post #210

With how much money everyone is spending, wouldn't it just be cheaper to build a private cross-country interstate where only AI drivers are allowed. Let humans drive the trucks to this interstate then let the AI take over. It seems like almost all the edge cases would be solved if you just got rid of other human drivers and let the vehicles network with one another.

When first reading this question I thought it was an obvious "no", but I looked into it's surprisingly close.

Total cost of interstate highway system: $128.9 billion [1].

Total invested in self driving technology as of 2017: $80 billion [2].

[1] https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/interstate/faq.cfm#question6

[2] https://www.brookings.edu/research/gauging-investment-in-sel...

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