Live data from Hacker News

Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

cloud.google.com

211–220 of 633 posts

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s interesting - I think you’re right. We might move our staging cluster into our main production deployment. More likely though, AWS or OpenShift running on bare metal on a beefy ATX tower in the office. We want to have production and staging as close to each other as possible, so this is an additional reason and a p0 flag on reducing the dependency on Google-specific bits of Kubernetes as much as possible, hope…

Kubespray works well for me for setting up a bare bones kubernetes cluster for the lab. I'll use helm to install metallb for the load balancer, which you can then tie into whatever egress controller you like to use. For persistent storage a simple NFS server is the bees knees. Works very well and a NFS provisioned is a helm install. Very nice, especially, over 10GbE. Do NOT dismiss NFSv4. It's actually very nice for…

> Have you used NFS for persistent storage in prod much?

I think NFS is heavily underrated. It's a good match for things like hosting VM images on a cluster and for Kubernetes.

In the past I really wanted to use things iSCSI for hosting VM images and such things, but I've found that NFS is actually a lot faster for a lot of things. There are complications to NFS, of course, but they haven't caused me problems.

I would be happy to use it in production, and have recommended it, but it's not unconditional. It depends on a number of different factors.

The only problem with NFS is how do you manage the actual NFS infrastructure? How much experience does your org have with NFS? Do you already have a existing file storage solution in production you can expand and use that with Kubernetes?

Like if your organization already has a lot of servers running ZFS, then that is a nice thing to leverage for NFS persistent storage. Since you already have expertise in-house it would be a mistake not to take advantage of it. I wouldn't recommend this approach for people not already doing it, though.

If you can afford some sort of enterprise-grade storage appliance that takes care of dedupe, checksums, failovers, and all that happy stuff, then that's great. Use that and it'll solve your problems. Especially if there is some sort of NFS provisoner that Kubernetes supports.

The only place were I would say it's a 'Hard No' is if you have some sort of high scalability requirements. Like if you wanted to start some web hosting company or needed to have hundreds of nodes in a cluster. In that case then distributed file systems is what you need... Self-hosted storage aka "Hyper Converged Infrastructure". The cost and overhead of managing these things is then relative small to the size of the cluster and what you are trying to do.

It's scary to me to have a cluster self-host storage because storage can use a huge amount of ram and cpu at the worst times. You can go from a happy low-resource cluster, then a node fails or other component takes a shit, and then while everything is recovering and checksum'ng (and lord knows what) the resource usage goes through the roof right during a critical time. The 'perfect storm' scenarios.

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#212
post #200

After this, I've been exploring other places to host our team's clusters... copied pricing below - EKS: $0.10/hour/cluster - Digital Ocean: Free (only charges for the nodes) - Azure: Free (only charges for the nodes) In the long run we'll probably try and build our stack on vendor-agnostic tools.. - Rancher - https://rancher.com/products/rancher/ - Infra.app - https://infra.app (mentioned a few weeks back on the Kube…

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22487110

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#213
post #197

Oh wow, one of the biggest reasons we picked Google Cloud was that you did not have to pay a flat fee for their managed Kubernetes service. Luckily there is Kubernetes support across all Cloud Providers so we're happy we're not vendor locked in. (biggest reason we picked Kubernetes in the first place.) We were thinking of using Stackdriver for logging, but we were scared of vendor locked in due to price increases or…

The last place I worked, with a couple of petabytes of monthly Stackdriver logs and a full embrace of almost every GKE/GCP tool, also switched to Prometheus + Grafana due to a lack of functionality within Stackdriver. I think you're making a good choice.

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#215
post #84
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GCP is actually more the 3rd inferior option, behind Azure. Gartner lists Azure as just behind AWS for IaaS providers, and GCP a more distant 3rd: https://pages.awscloud.com/Gartner-Magic-Quadrant-for-Infras...

Anecdotal, I know, but for prospective Latacora customers this is absolutely not reflected in market share. It's AWS first, GCP second, Azure very distant third. I'd happily believe Azure is dominating in some segments where MS showers prospective customers with millions of dollars in credit, but IMO a blind person can see Azure does not have the product offering to warrant a "completeness of vision" that is right on…

What essential product offerings is Azure missing that AWS have?

My experience is that once AWS offers a new service that gets attention, a few month later also Azure offers it - and vice versa.

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#216
AKS still has a free control plane. GCP won my business for a bit, but quickly lost it based on some features. I still love StackDriver and BigQuery, but don’t love doing business with GCP- the sales/support experience was pretty lacking, networking for serverless was immature for multi-region, and what they are doing with Anthos feels like Oracle (it is).

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kubespray works well for me for setting up a bare bones kubernetes cluster for the lab. I'll use helm to install metallb for the load balancer, which you can then tie into whatever egress controller you like to use. For persistent storage a simple NFS server is the bees knees. Works very well and a NFS provisioned is a helm install. Very nice, especially, over 10GbE. Do NOT dismiss NFSv4. It's actually very nice for…

(replying to freedomben): NFS has worked fairly well for persistent file storage that doesn't require high performance for reads/writes (e.g. good for media storage for a website with a CDN fronting a lot of traffic, good for some kinds of other data storage). It would be a terrible solution for things like database storage or other high-performance needs (clustering and separate PVs with high IOPS storage would be b…

It's good to have multiple options if you want to host databases in the cluster.

For example you could use NFS for 90% of the storage needs for logging and sharing files between pods. Then use local storage, FCOE, or iSCSI-backed PVs for databases.

If you are doing bare hardware and your requirements for latency are not too stringent then not hosting databases in the cluster is also a good approach. Just used dedicated systems.

If you can get state out of the cluster then that makes things easier.

All of this depends on a huge number of other factors, of course.

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#218

Time to dump GCP then. It's not even that the fee is that large, but rather that this is once again Google failing on a long term commitment and shafting those on their platform once again. This was one of the benefits that was pushed by their sales team when they called us up to market GCP over AWS and their EKS offering. Doesn't matter that they are price matching, Google's inability to actually commit to long term…

If the main value of GKE over DIY is $73, you should totally DIY. I mostly try not to be too Google-focused here, but I have to say... I'm pretty proud of GKE, and I think it offers a lot of value other than just being cheap. Managing clusters is not always easy. GKE handles all of that for you - including integrations, qualifications, upgrades, and patching clusters transparently BEFORE public security disclosures h…

>If the main value of GKE over DIY is $73, you should totally DIY.

It's not the fee itself, it's the worry that GKE will do what Google Maps did and massively increase fees with very little notice, causing people to scramble to migrate.

Google has a really bad reputation right now when it comes to cancelling projects that people have built their businesses upon, or jacking up fees quickly. The $73 is irrelevant on its own - the issue is (a lack of) customer trust.

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#219
post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For last 7 years I am running DO and never had any issue. I never understand why it is looked down. In fact I have faced so many issues with AWS (particulary their old hardward). In one case, our ec2 instance was rebooting frequently. AWS team didn't accept any issue from there end and after few weeks ask us to upgrade instace because of bad health. In my experience, AWS is a very expensive cloud with clunky UI and b…

I recently tried to spin up a VM for my own use in AWS, but I had to do a rate increase because I wanted a beefier machine. Easy peasy. My experience was comically bad. ====================== First email from AWS (several days after my request): ====================== Thank you for submitting your Limi Increase request. I'm contacting your to inform you that we've received your Workspaces Application Manager - Total…

I always suspect, do they still copy configuration manually ? Is this delay because of that ? There was article where in early days AWS was doing it. Even amazon.com was not running on AWS those days. Hope it is not the case.

Re: Google Kubernetes Engine is introducing a cluster management fee on June 6

#220
post #187

This entire kerfluffle is a microcosm of so many things wrong with the industry. First, so many people have decided to use k8 for wrong reasons that is mind boggling. Those are mainly customers. Customers are often led into decisions by their own developers who are more interested in learning new things or in making themselves attractive for the next job. Yes sales people from the providers also help make this happen…

> dick pic app so fuck em.

> fucking

> shit

> horseshit

> arrogant fucksteins

> crap

I'm not usually one to flaunt the HN guidelines, but I would suggest a read-through, and perhaps exploring different venues for venting frustrations.

Post reply on HN