Spot the Drowning Child (2015) • Hacker News Board

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#231

Post by rtkwe » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:10 PM UTC

biztos wrote: post #144

rtkwe wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's partially because if you can teach them those skills you can probably also teach them to swim full stop. A big difficulty with that is most schools would also have to travel to get access to a pool. I've only gone to one school before college that had a pool and it was a charter school on a local college campus so they had access to that pool, some schools might have to travel 30m-1h to get to a pool if they're…

When I was a kid in the 70's in rural California, we were bussed almost an hour to a bigger school for mandatory swimming lessons. I don't remember at what age but it was elementary school, I think maybe 5th-6th grade. Several grades were grouped together. Most (all?) of us could already "swim" basically, since there were lakes and rivers near the small towns and kids usually got free swimming lessons around age 5. T…

I think it's something schools should do but the logistics of doing it is difficult. You don't want to do it for a whole gym class and you want more instructors available than schools have staff to provide so they have to work with some other group to get enough people to work individually with the kids.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#232

Post by mcv » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:13 PM UTC

killjoywashere wrote: post #214

keanzu wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somehow people don't realize the danger that pools possess. Swimming is one of the few activities that children engage in which can go so wrong as to end up in their death. I would suggest that it is borderline negligence for a parent to put a child in such a dangerous situation without proper precautions (supervision). I wouldn't let a small child I am responsible for go into a pool alone regardless of the presence…

> I wouldn't let a small child I am responsible for go into a pool alone You would. Let me give you the scenario: you're home alone with the three kids, you've been chasing them around, doing laundry, cleaning up spilled grape juice, telling Jenny to stop cutting Tommy's hair, etc. Finally, you think everyone is down for a nap. You turn on the game. 5 minutes later, 5 minutes, you think "It's too quiet...". You get u…

I don't mind leaving my child unattended for a short period in a safe area. But not near a pool.

Of course luxury homes with their own pool in the backyard put rather a big strain on safety around your own home. Put a good fence around it, I guess.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#233

Post by ryandrake » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:16 PM UTC

pmarreck wrote: post #180

buckminster wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Making fireworks that closely resembled pipe bombs (almost blew leg off)

oh jesus. yeah, exactly! I had a pyromaniac phase. Once set a field on fire. Things could have gone extremely worse.

Fellow 90's kid-pyro checking in. I remember when my father finally found my stash of black powder, metal tubing, various makeshift cannons, and flammable chemicals. Didn't really get in trouble--he was relieved it wasn't something as dangerous as weed.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#234

Post by mcv » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:18 PM UTC

astura wrote: post #198

atoav wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up near a lake in the Alps and I am quite sure that any floatation device in Europe that is not safe for leaving your kids unsupervised has a big warning sign printed on the floatatiin device itself. An exeption were these orange things you strap onto a child's arms, and inflate, which they can't really remove by themselves.

>An exeption were these orange things you strap onto a child's arms, and inflate, which they can't really remove by themselves. Those are widely considered NOT safe, a non-swimmer child is probably much safer without them than with them, as using them lulls the caregiver into a false sense of security and they pay much less attention to them. They also teach children the wrong posture for swimming/floating, which can…

The problem there, though, is the lack of parental supervision, not the armbands themselves. The bands do keep the child's head above water. But no matter what, parents need to understand that you don't leave a small child alone near water.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#235

Post by keanzu » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:19 PM UTC

matthewowen wrote: post #223

AstralStorm wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or you're incorrectly trained. You should always be able to flip and float on your back if push comes to shove, and in that position you can swim just using your arms.

"incorrectly trained" is what people typically mean when they say "not a strong swimmer". anyone who has swum alongside 10 year olds on swim teams will understand that you can swim quite strongly even without being "strong" in the muscular sense.

Exactly it isn't physical strength. A strong swimmer is someone who removes "drowning" from the list of options as long as they remain conscious. This is a critical point when boating - friends have asked why I always wear a lifejacket when on a small boat; as a strong swimmer surely I have no need of one. In a boating accident the "conscious" part isn't guaranteed. Get hit by the boom and go overboard and you are going to need that lifejacket.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#236

Post by mcv » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:20 PM UTC

vict00ms wrote: post #154

atoav wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up near a lake in the Alps and I am quite sure that any floatation device in Europe that is not safe for leaving your kids unsupervised has a big warning sign printed on the floatatiin device itself. An exeption were these orange things you strap onto a child's arms, and inflate, which they can't really remove by themselves.

Those are called "water wings" in the US and the person you were replying to feels quite the opposite about their safety; the ones I've seen available for purchase in the states are easy to dislodge accidentally.

All of the ones I've encountered in Europe are practically impossible to dislodge once they've been inflated.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#237

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:25 PM UTC

hutzlibu wrote: post #190

pmarreck wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Swimming is one of the few activities that children engage in which can go so wrong as to end up in their death Climbing trees (fall risk) Climbing tall playground equipment (I broke my arm falling from a height of just 3 feet once, on one of those). Broken neck, etc. Playing in the street (cars) Bicycling (can get hit by a car, sigh) Trampoline (don't get me started) Exploring (falling down deep wells, etc.) The G…

Household: - various kitchentools, knives, fork - other tools, axe, hammer - (poison) cleaning stuff - climbing on the tish and falling on their neck - ... Yes, life is dangerous, yet sadly most parents today take the approach of avoiding all dangers at all cost. And of course you should not leave dangerous things around and make it as safe as possible, but how can one learn, how to deal with dangers, when all the sl…

[deleted]

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#238

Post by ben7799 » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:25 PM UTC

dmos62 wrote: post #168

sq_ wrote: post #110

Things like this give me so much respect for lifeguards, especially ocean lifeguards. Being a lifeguard in a pool is clearly tough enough; being in charge of a stretch of sand with people moving in and out constantly has to be absolutely insane. Especially since a kid could run in, get smashed by a wave, and be underwater in the time you spent glancing down the beach the other way.

In beaches, I think often lifeguards rely upon being summoned and being able to get there quickly (beach vehicles). That's in case s/he has to cover kilometers of sand. Of course in such cases a lifeguard can't help with the Instictive Drowning Response: as the article points out, if you're affected by IDR you can hold out only 20-60 seconds.

Those are often places that aren't really fully staffed.

If the place is fully staffed and well managed the beach vehicles shouldn't be needed cause the lifeguards should be close enough to not need them. Most places I've seen ATVs in use the ATVs were being used by volunteers who were not lifeguards but watch the beach and call the coast guard/lifeguards on the phone if there is an emergency. The main beach I see this at is ultra dangerous with cold water, dangerous undertows, thousands of harbor seals in the water, and now has occasional great white sharks hunting the seals!

Making a beach safe enough requires a lot of well trained lifeguards. Not many beaches are ever staffed like that.

If it's dangerous enough some of the guards might need to be in the water on personal watercraft. Usually I've only seen this in super dangerous surfing locations though.

A full lifeguard training program also typically contains training on using a rescue board which is basically like a surfboard and can be super useful in ocean surf.

Baywatch was always super funny.. they carried Rescue Buoys which were near obsolete in favor of Rescue Tubes by the 90s. (The rescue tube is flexible and can be clipped into a circle once you reach the victim.) But the scenes on Baywatch would have realistically often have been done with both a rescue buoy + a rescue board.

Ocean surf is super dangerous, water temps can be dangerous at the ocean. Then in some places you've got sharks, jellyfish, coral reefs.

It's super intimidating compared to working a pool.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#239

Post by sys32768 » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:25 PM UTC

I never got to properly thank the 15-yo lifeguard who saved my 7-yo from certain drowning in a crowded artificial lake pool.

We turned away for what only seemed a minute and he was going under. He was slightly blue in the face when the life guard brought him out.

The weird thing is he didn't fight or flail. He just sort of faded away into the water, and it struck me as especially weird that he didn't seemed scared at all after.

It has haunted me ever since just how easy it can be for a child to drown. Many swim lessons for my child later, I still watch him like a hawk and insist on life jackets in any moving water conditions.

Bondi Rescue, a series on Netflix about a team of Australian lifeguards, is instructive and entertaining.

Re: Spot the Drowning Child (2015)

#240

Post by opwieurposiu » Wed, Mar 04, 2020, 4:27 PM UTC

japhyr wrote: post #191

> Parents – children playing in the water make noise. When they get quiet, you get to them and find out why. If you're a new parent and haven't heard this advice before, this is one of the key takeaways. It also applies any time young kids are playing out of sight. If your kid is in their room and it gets quiet longer than usual, it's a good idea to go peek in on them.

If my 3yo goes into the bathroom and gets quiet, 9/10 he is making toothpaste/shampoo/toilet paper art all over the floor.