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Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

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81–90 of 137 posts

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#81

i think this article misses the mark. consider that the preliminary WHO incident report regarding the chinese response to the outbreak in wuhan essentially said that the radical and severe measures taken by the chinese government were the only thing which allowed for some semblance of control over the course of weeks. if we assume that the chinese are not fabricating their numbers, it's not much of a relief for us be…

> the CDC is asleep at the wheel as a result of political pressure or potentially severe incompetence

Trump fired the entire pandemic response team.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-fire-pandemic-team/

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#82

This might be a case of excessively binary thinking? Stocking up on things you normally use is not panic buying, it's a sensible no-regrets precaution. But it tends to get called "hoarding" anyway. Buying stuff you don't normally use can also be sensible. Consider putting together an earthquake kit in California. Unfortunately, having a pandemic kit ready isn't something most people do, but maybe it should be? There…

> I'm also wondering if there might be an untapped market to help people be prepared without keeping a lot of inventory themselves? Usually there is advance notice for a pandemic so you just want some assurance that someone can ship you something when it's time. This would avoid shortages by making it profitable to keep inventory.

This is an interesting idea, but you'd need to be really careful to avoid price-gouging laws (e.g. not accept any customers after the potential disaster begins). Even then the govt might still come after you if those products you keep for people cost significantly more then the local price.

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hell, I'd even prefer to get it, so I'm over it ( 32 years old) 32 years on Earth and you're unfamiliar with mutation?

X years old and not aware of statistical probability? Mutation can happen if there are many generations in between. My option could have 1-3 generations in between which is far more realistic in a "controlled environment" than in a uncontrolled one.

Your option is not reality and you're trivializing this to the common flu.

Would you have done the same with SARS? Because it's similar to that disease (from what we know: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1287568/).

It can destroy your airway and it may even lie dormant in your brain and come back when you get another flu. Surprise! Now you're dealing with a fever and pneumonia in your 30s.

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-in-charts-covid-...

Look at the global spread map. 92,303 infected vs 48,190 recovered (and these numbers are probably WAY underreported). There are 40k people still in recovery? How many more is that going to add to the death toll? The death rate is 3.3% very much not like the flu.

And if you go get sick and need medical treatment, guess what? Hospitals are going to be backed up.

It's just an incredibly irresponsible response. But be my guest and start licking some doorknobs. I'll be quarantining myself.

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#84
Did I panic? I don’t know. I began to prepare in early February for the possibility of draconian cordon sanitaire, widespread panic, and the consequent interruption in supply after learning that in Wuhan initial warnings had been suppressed, and mass gatherings permitted during a time the virus was in the population. Because of that head start, and the dramatic R_0 of this bug, I sensed this was no ordinary outbreak.

I resumed my efforts in mid February after learning that the CDC had rejected WHO test kits, then had produced defective test kits, which, coupled with unreasonably strict test criteria, caused virtually no surveillance in the US to be done. It did not inspire confidence that mass gatherings continued to be held, and were even encouraged (e.g., San Francisco's Mayor's issuance of a statement encouraging RSA conference attendance, or the recent Bernie Sanders rally in San Jose).

Note that the failure of the US to adequately surveil, moreover its failure to respond quickly to that failure, mirrors what transpired in Wuhan. In the case of Wuhan, the national state only became aware of the problem when the local medical system was overwhelmed, and the epidemic had gone, ahem, viral.

Given the similarity between the surveillance gap in China and the US, and the failure to respond to that gap in the US, I thought prudent to continue to prepare.

I might, though, have a different perspective due to the fact that my father was head of serology and virology labs with reporting, diagnostic, and research responsibilities for animal diseases for a US state. Or, maybe a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, I don’t know. But I can, thus, recommend journalistic potboilers such as “Rats, Lice, and Men” and “Plagues and Peoples”. More seriously, David Quammen, given the background he gained in evolutionary biology from writing “Song of the Dodo”, in “Spillover” gives what’s probably the best elucidation of zoonotic pathogens.

Previous zoonotic pathogenic outbreaks have killed more than probably all wars combined. Disruption of habitat by human colonization and climate change have intersected with mass jet travel to increase the likelihood that pathogens will make it from animal reservoirs to our species.

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#85

I live 1 mile from Evergreen Hospital and 3 miles from the Life Care facility, and I'm immunocompromised. Most of my B lymphocytes and a bunch of my T helper cells are gone. In the past couple of days 7 immunocompromised people within walking distance of me were killed by this thing. I don't think I'm in hysteria, but I sure as hell am not leaving my house until I can be convinced that it's under control in my area.…

You’re one of the few folks on HN talking about this who actually has something to worry about...but ironically, you’re not spreading misinformation or panic, like so many other people. I hope this doesn’t end up being as bad for sick people as it seems it might.

That said, I think your comment about “failing an open-book test” is a bit unfair. Yes, the governmental response around the world has been bungled, and no, it isn’t good. But it’s also pretty much true that there was never going to be a chance to contain this virus, outside of isolating it to Wuhan in November (i.e. before anyone knew about it). And a bad flu will rip through vulnerable populations as well...it’s why we beg and plead for people to get the flu shot every year (even though they never do...)

There is simply no way to contain a respiratory virus that has spread to tens of thousands of people. At that point, you need to plan for isolation and care for the vulnerable, and stop flailing around with travel bans (which don’t work) and quarantines and whatnot. It’s insane to me, for example, that Seattle public health officials are operating as if this virus isn’t already endemic. They have good evidence that it is!

The biggest test we’re failing right now is controlling panic and allocating resources intelligently.

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#86
post #85

I live 1 mile from Evergreen Hospital and 3 miles from the Life Care facility, and I'm immunocompromised. Most of my B lymphocytes and a bunch of my T helper cells are gone. In the past couple of days 7 immunocompromised people within walking distance of me were killed by this thing. I don't think I'm in hysteria, but I sure as hell am not leaving my house until I can be convinced that it's under control in my area.…

You’re one of the few folks on HN talking about this who actually has something to worry about...but ironically, you’re not spreading misinformation or panic, like so many other people. I hope this doesn’t end up being as bad for sick people as it seems it might. That said, I think your comment about “failing an open-book test” is a bit unfair. Yes, the governmental response around the world has been bungled, and no,…

I have parents and grandparents. I like people. Im an uncle of 3 young kids.

I'm worries and don't think it is a problem if we would reduce the global economy fora year to get rid of it.

Or that everyone on the planet should get vaccinated and should life more aware.

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#87
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 4) The virus doesn't last long on dry surfaces, hot weather (bumped up the heat in house by a few degrees, yet comfortable enough). What's your source for this? What temperature is required to see this effect? How sure are you that your house is hot enough?

I haven't heard about heat before, but generally for the flu high (50%) humidity is very helpful.

It's low humidit. You can read why on Wikipedia

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#88
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But didn't Trump say it was an hoax? If so, are the Trump supporters the ones that are least worried?

No, Trump did not say the virus was a hoax, that was fake news.

> “This is their new hoax,” he said, referring to the coronavirus.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/28/trump-says-the-coronavirus-i...

Straight from the horses mouth. But I'm sure he was misquoted and taken out of context...

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#89
post #86
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re one of the few folks on HN talking about this who actually has something to worry about...but ironically, you’re not spreading misinformation or panic, like so many other people. I hope this doesn’t end up being as bad for sick people as it seems it might. That said, I think your comment about “failing an open-book test” is a bit unfair. Yes, the governmental response around the world has been bungled, and no,…

I have parents and grandparents. I like people. Im an uncle of 3 young kids. I'm worries and don't think it is a problem if we would reduce the global economy fora year to get rid of it. Or that everyone on the planet should get vaccinated and should life more aware.

[deleted]

Re: Mass hysteria is making coronavirus worse than it is

#90
post #86
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re one of the few folks on HN talking about this who actually has something to worry about...but ironically, you’re not spreading misinformation or panic, like so many other people. I hope this doesn’t end up being as bad for sick people as it seems it might. That said, I think your comment about “failing an open-book test” is a bit unfair. Yes, the governmental response around the world has been bungled, and no,…

I have parents and grandparents. I like people. Im an uncle of 3 young kids. I'm worries and don't think it is a problem if we would reduce the global economy fora year to get rid of it. Or that everyone on the planet should get vaccinated and should life more aware.

First, the kids are fine. This virus doesn’t really seem to affect children.

Second, “worrying” accomplishes nothing. Wash your hands; avoid people when you’re sick. Avoid sick people. Have a couple weeks of groceries on hand if you think quarantine is likely. These are things you should be doing every year during flu season.

But I can’t stress this enough: there’s nothing we can be doing, rationally, where we can shave off a bit of economic growth in exchange for less virus. At this point, the virus is endemic. Quarantines make panicky people feel good, but don’t actually help. Isolation of Wuhan was a good thing to try, but it failed.

It’s time for the next step: acknowledgement that the virus is everywhere, and directly protecting vulnerable populations. This is going to happen sooner or later.

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