Live data from Hacker News

More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

online.wsj.com

11–20 of 32 posts

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#11
post #9
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soon most of the management will be outsourced as well. It makes sense to have someone who understands the culture of the workers.

Not too wise. Google for "787 Dreamliner outsourcing". It was costly experience for Boeing.

I wonder what percentage of the companies surveyed plan to employ R&D employees directly. Were Boeing's problems due to offshoring or outsourcing?

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#12

As far as outsourcing stories go, I find this one to have a very nice silver lining for developed countries. R&D is not factory floor oppressive work for people who have no options and often little political power. It is the domain of the intelligent; people with options who are more fully aware of what their options are. IOW, a true middle class. The more the thinking class grows the better all of us are. R&D is not…

> R&D is not a zero sum game like manufacturing. With manufacturing there is only so much demand for the manufactured goods; only so much material with which to make the goods etc.

The material wasn't really a problem in most industries since early 1950s. The demand is also permanently growing, with population levels increasing, wealth being created etc.

R&D however always follows manufacturing, it's just the nature of their relationship. It can not last long in ivory tower, no matter what politicians tell.

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#13
post #8
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soon most of the management will be outsourced as well. It makes sense to have someone who understands the culture of the workers.

I've been thinking this for years. Why not just outsource management?

Because they're the ones deciding what gets outsourced.

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#14
post #4

"Five years from now, Mr. Wadhwa said he believes Indian workers will be developing software on par with programmers in Silicon Valley." Russian/Estonian/[insert any country] are doing that for a while. Just not in their own country, but in Silicon Valley (50% of Silicon Valley startup has at least one founder that's not from USA). For creme de la creme products you need more than just good Indian "worker".

And those countries produce the top super-models too.

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#16
post #2

Wait, wasn't R&D the piece of a corporation's work that was going to stay in the US, because every worker here was talented, good at problem solving and so forth?

The truth of the matter is that everything that can be outsourced will be outsourced. The idea that "brain work" would remain in the US was just a rationalization to enable the first wave of outsourcing to get underway.

In the 1980's the driving force was quality and the ones to emulate were the Japanese. Now the driving force is cost, quality is not that important, and the ones to emulate are the Chinese/Indians.

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#17
post #9
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soon most of the management will be outsourced as well. It makes sense to have someone who understands the culture of the workers.

Not too wise. Google for "787 Dreamliner outsourcing". It was costly experience for Boeing.

WSJ article seems to be talking about offshore R&D work, not necessarily outsourced R&D work. 787 Dreamliner problems seems to be due to outsourcing to contractors and subcontractors (combined with offshoring): http://articles.latimes.com/2011/feb/15/business/la-fi-hiltz...

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#18

As far as outsourcing stories go, I find this one to have a very nice silver lining for developed countries. R&D is not factory floor oppressive work for people who have no options and often little political power. It is the domain of the intelligent; people with options who are more fully aware of what their options are. IOW, a true middle class. The more the thinking class grows the better all of us are. R&D is not…

Note that there is R&D and 'corporate R&D'

These aren't necessarily research positions, they are often just offshored software development work and even tech support call centers.

Anything that isn't billed per widget is often counted as R&D - especially when it comes to tax breaks!

Re: More Companies Plan to Put R&D Overseas

#20
post #16
post #2

Wait, wasn't R&D the piece of a corporation's work that was going to stay in the US, because every worker here was talented, good at problem solving and so forth?

The truth of the matter is that everything that can be outsourced will be outsourced. The idea that "brain work" would remain in the US was just a rationalization to enable the first wave of outsourcing to get underway. In the 1980's the driving force was quality and the ones to emulate were the Japanese. Now the driving force is cost, quality is not that important, and the ones to emulate are the Chinese/Indians.

Exactly. The "brain work" rationalization was just a way to sell outsourcing to the middle class, enabling conservatives to break working-class political power. The next wave, well underway since the tech bubble reduced communication costs to zero, will break the middle class.
Post reply on HN