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Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

nextmontreal.com

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Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#51

Post by neilk »

evanprodromou wrote: post #22
jleyank wrote: post #12

Getting Yanks to Montreal is easy as long as (a) they are single, (b) they are married and the spouse doesn't work and there are no school-age kids or (c) the spouse knows French and there are no school-age kids. Getting a work visa at the border merely takes a CV and an offer letter. School-age kids require French schooling, and customer-facing positions require French (both of which might be show stoppers). It's a…

Bringing people to Montreal in the summer is a pretty easy recruitment strategy.

That's just cruel, though.

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#52

Post by p90x »

bravura wrote: post #30

[disclosure: I'm a personal friend of the author of this article.] I lived in Montreal for three years, or four winters, depending upon how you count. I believe that Montreal has the most important element necessary to become an open-source startup hub, namely a lot of good talent. The language barrier exists, but is not strong enough that it has hindered any open-source efforts in Montreal (as far as I've seen). The…

i don't understand the purpose of the article, or of your post. if the city has what it takes it will happen. if it doesn't it won't. everything else is conversation. that is how i look at it, what am i missing?

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#53

Post by sedachv »

RobotGrrl wrote: post #41

Interesting discussion. I make a lot of software for Arduinos for my robots and publish it open source on my blog. I rarely get contacted from fellow Canadians (let alone fellow Montrealers). >_> Arduino is a super example of open source, so if Montreal were to be a "hub", that would entail that a lot more people would be excited about Open Source and would be downloading the code or getting in contact, right? I find…

http://foulab.org/ is where most of the visible arduino work happens in Montreal, although I'm sure you know about that.

I think you're overestimating the amount of interested people have in Free Software/open source and Arduinos, though.

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#54

Post by yummyfajitas »

delano wrote: post #39
yummyfajitas wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How will Montreal represent a bridge to anyplace besides France? While France isn't nothing (60 million people with a bit less disposable income than the US), USA+Canada+France is less than 20% bigger than USA+Canada.

It's not limited to language. It's also very much about culture. Montreal is literally and figuratively half-way between North America and Europe.

Montreal is literally and figuratively half-way between North America and Europe.

Either I'm really bad at geography, or it's only figuratively and not literally.

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#55

Post by xster »

imack wrote: post #21
yummyfajitas wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How will Montreal represent a bridge to anyplace besides France? While France isn't nothing (60 million people with a bit less disposable income than the US), USA+Canada+France is less than 20% bigger than USA+Canada.

Adding to your point, it is very important to note that France French != Quebec French. When a Montrealer goes to Paris and starts speaking French, the Parisian will get confused and respond in English if they know it.

The French definitely make fun of Quebecers but will also definitely not speak English instead. If the Quebecer has gone to school (which I believe is the target audience here), the accent will just be a minor nuisance.

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#56

Post by xster »

gamble wrote: post #26

I'm not sure I agree with this article, but Montreal does have one thing in it's favor when it comes to the tech industry: incredible subsidies. With the low wages and cost of living, plus gov't handouts, it can be cheaper to hire developers in Montreal than in Beijing.

Agreed. Montreal developers do have a pretty low salary range and at up to 50%, the tax credit definitely makes a dent.

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#57

Post by jeromegn »

danudey wrote: post #46
jeromegn wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personal income tax may be higher, but the advantages far outweigh the cost. I'm thinking about: free healthcare, extremely low electricity cost, cheap rent (pretty much half as much as SF's rent) and everything that comes with living in a major city. RE French: Ever learned a new programming language to go work somewhere? What's the difference? You don't have to be fluent in French, you have to understand it enough…

You can get all of those benefits by living in Vancouver (though rent isn't as cheap here, apartments and suites are much better maintained). On top of that, the weather is better, the people are friendlier, and you don't have to worry as much about not getting a position solely because your language skills aren't up to snuff.

I guess my comment (apart from the French part) applies to most big cities in Canada. Thanks for pointing that out.

"the people are friendlier" is too subjective though, can't really be sure of that.

Getting a position in a startup or open source team here isn't up to spoken language (unless like said early, it's customer facing). I think startups here prefer English. French is just that little extra (sad thing to say, but it's the truth).

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#58

Post by neilk »

danudey wrote: post #46
jeromegn wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personal income tax may be higher, but the advantages far outweigh the cost. I'm thinking about: free healthcare, extremely low electricity cost, cheap rent (pretty much half as much as SF's rent) and everything that comes with living in a major city. RE French: Ever learned a new programming language to go work somewhere? What's the difference? You don't have to be fluent in French, you have to understand it enough…

You can get all of those benefits by living in Vancouver (though rent isn't as cheap here, apartments and suites are much better maintained). On top of that, the weather is better, the people are friendlier, and you don't have to worry as much about not getting a position solely because your language skills aren't up to snuff.

Just a slight correction on "friendlier"; people in English Canada are more friendly according to the American norm, where you have one (maybe two) close confidants, and then many shallow cordial relations.

French Canadians do it another way. They have a small circle of friends they would do anything for, but most of the outside world is excluded. If you move to Montreal it will take a few years to break through into a social circle, unless you hang out only with expats.

Also, don't go to Quebec expecting the HI I'LL BE YOUR SLAVE TODAY treatment at a restaurant. Just... don't.

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#59

Post by danudey »

jeromegn wrote: post #57
danudey wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get all of those benefits by living in Vancouver (though rent isn't as cheap here, apartments and suites are much better maintained). On top of that, the weather is better, the people are friendlier, and you don't have to worry as much about not getting a position solely because your language skills aren't up to snuff.

I guess my comment (apart from the French part) applies to most big cities in Canada. Thanks for pointing that out. "the people are friendlier" is too subjective though, can't really be sure of that. Getting a position in a startup or open source team here isn't up to spoken language (unless like said early, it's customer facing). I think startups here prefer English. French is just that little extra (sad thing to sa…

"the people are friendlier" is too subjective though, can't really be sure of that.

Well that's a point, and it all depends on your own mentality, but I found that the culture in general is more friendly (people will smile at you more, strangers will start or participate in conversation, people hold doors, etc.) in Vancouver compared to Montreal.

Another problem I saw was that when trying to socialize in some social groups, the conversation would tend to be entirely in French solely for reasons of preference (given an equal anglophone/francophone split), making it incredibly difficult to do anything other than sit there and pick out the occasional word.

It can go both ways of course, depending on the group in which you find yourself, but it's just one of those little frustrations that can make it difficult to integrate into social circles in Montreal vs. an anglophone city like Vancouver.

Re: Can Montreal Become an Open Source Startup Hub?

#60

Post by arach »

danudey wrote: post #45
arach wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're exaggerating. Parisians may tease Quebecers, but that's just to keep themselves in teasing shape. Teasing is a sport, you gotta practice. Most French people will be able to understand most Montrealers. It should be noted that France itself has many regional accents that are quite strong. Also to be noted, there is a steady flow of young French people immigrating to Montreal.

Most French people will be able to understand most Montrealers sometimes, in the same way that someone from Britain would be able to understand a Cajun sometimes. The language is very divergent, with franglais words sprinkled here or there, shortened words, differing word usage, etc. On top of that, for the reasons above as well as others (including their accent), people from France really dislike listening to people…

I don't know enough about the Cajun English language to comment on your analogy.

For what it's worth, here is wikipedia's article on Quebec French [citation needed]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_French#Mutual_intelligib...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_French#Overview_of_the_r...

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