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We need to take CO2 out of the sky – an overview of climate tech

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Re: We need to take CO2 out of the sky – an overview of climate tech

#261

Post by davedx »

aforwardslash wrote: post #118
davedx wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AFAIK tree sequestration is marginal compared to the amount of co2 to be captured Nope. Tree sequestration is extremely effective on a global scale. That's why it's so important that we prevent deforestation. "Intact forests and those re-growing after disturbance (like harvesting or windthrow) sequestered around 4 billion tonnes of carbon per year over the measurement period — equivalent to almost 60% of emissions…

Well, the study considers already existing forests. Is it feasible to eg. increase global forestation by 100% to offset 60% of emissions? Not sure. Also, it considers a limited timespan. While it is not that relevant for undisturbed forests that usually have a stable ecosystem (trees born and die gradually), it may be an issue with disturbed ones; trees will tend to have about the same age and the same duration; this…

> plus the fact that co2 tends to concentrate higher in the atmosphere, way above the average tree line

I looked this up and seems it's the opposite. I'd politely suggest you check your assumptions are correct.

https://www.quora.com/Is-there-less-carbon-dioxide-at-higher...

https://667-per-cm.net/2015/08/04/atmospheric-concentration-...

Re: We need to take CO2 out of the sky – an overview of climate tech

#262

Post by antisthenes »

labawi wrote: post #244
antisthenes wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you consume and produce things in a way that doesn't release net CO₂ So far global output of wealth and well-being is directly tied to emissions and consumption of fossil fuels. We have a 110-year long precedent for that. You could even argue it started with the Industrial Revolution, so the period is longer. France is probably the only example of a country that came close enough to decoupling economic prosperit…

> France .. produce 5GT of CO2 per person. 5 GT (5 000 000 T) is unfathomably large. They produce about 5T = 5000 kg CO₂ / person / year, which is 5 · 12 / (12+2·16) = 1.4 ton of carbon / coal or 1.7 m³ = 1700 l of diesel. Going by Wikipedia 2017 list[1], they are about 5% above average per-capita CO₂ emissions. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_di...

5% above average in emissions, while being more than 100% above the average GDP per capita. ($38,000 vs $17,300 world )

I'd say that's a pretty good track record for creating prosperity.

And yes, thank you for the correction, GT was the wrong unit.

Re: We need to take CO2 out of the sky – an overview of climate tech

#263

Post by labawi »

antisthenes wrote: post #262
labawi wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> France .. produce 5GT of CO2 per person. 5 GT (5 000 000 T) is unfathomably large. They produce about 5T = 5000 kg CO₂ / person / year, which is 5 · 12 / (12+2·16) = 1.4 ton of carbon / coal or 1.7 m³ = 1700 l of diesel. Going by Wikipedia 2017 list[1], they are about 5% above average per-capita CO₂ emissions. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_di...

5% above average in emissions, while being more than 100% above the average GDP per capita. ($38,000 vs $17,300 world ) I'd say that's a pretty good track record for creating prosperity. And yes, thank you for the correction, GT was the wrong unit.

> .. good track record for creating prosperity.

Please don't forget to qualify you mean economic prosperity. It's a wholly different matter than happiness, health etc. The correlation is positive (I guess) but far from 100%.

French track record is not bad, but I would still hesitate to call it good. Going by [1], they haven't notably decreased their emissions since 2011, they are worse than Sweden and Switzerland, and if poorer countries follow, it's still the kind of emissions that take us into wild climate territory with mass migrations, unrest and I would hope not war.

Good for some inspiration, better than my country, but far from enough.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_di...

Re: We need to take CO2 out of the sky – an overview of climate tech

#264

Post by acd »

philbarr wrote: post #129
acd wrote: post #120

We need to stop consuming like there is no tomorrow. This is driven by advertisement convincing consumers they should buy products they may not need. Secondly we need to make products which lasts a life time. I see root cause that we need to remodel the economy from market economy consumerism to a circular sustainable economy. Most current economists is saying expand expand expand, but that increases co2 levels due t…

How would this "circular sustainable economy" work? People tend to think of there being only two versions of the economy available - the government tells us what stuff to make, or free markets determine what we make. We would need a way of incentivising re-use, and of incentivising companies to make things re-usable. Currently the only way to make more money is to make and sell more stuff.

You design and build products which are 100% recyclable. Own less stuff, give away things you do not need. Price waste and good sustainable eco systems

Re: We need to take CO2 out of the sky – an overview of climate tech

#266

Post by therealdrag0 »

jsomau wrote: post #195
acd wrote: post #120

We need to stop consuming like there is no tomorrow. This is driven by advertisement convincing consumers they should buy products they may not need. Secondly we need to make products which lasts a life time. I see root cause that we need to remodel the economy from market economy consumerism to a circular sustainable economy. Most current economists is saying expand expand expand, but that increases co2 levels due t…

I've been building a browser extension called Curb Your Consumerism that detects when you're on a checkout page for a website and redirects you to a screen that shows you how long you had to work to earn the purchase you're about to make. The idea is to get people to more consciously consume and reduce their consumption. It still needs work, and I'm hoping to find a way to approximate the CO2 impact of their purchase…

Neat idea. Might also have toggles for displaying "how much CO2 you could displace if you donated it to carbon off-set causes." or "how much of a life could you save if you donated it to meleria prevention" (3k a life?)

(I'm not your target audience because I struggle to buy stuff even when its cheap and I'm flush with money hah)

Re: We need to take CO2 out of the sky – an overview of climate tech

#267

Post by RobinL »

distances wrote: post #235
RobinL wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. I spent some time making a calculator [0] to help me understand what matters when it comes to energy consumption. This made it very clear that by far the best way most consumers can make a difference is just to stop buying stuff. In the west we get away with 'low'(er) emissions because we import a huge amount of CO2 though imported goods - maps of total energy consumption are quite interesting here [1] Stoppi…

Nice calculator. What's assumed as energy source for warm water of it's not part of the electricity consumption?

Gas - which is typical for a UK household. In fact most of the calculator is based implicitly on UK norms.
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