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NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

neutralino.js.org

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Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#61
> There are some drawbacks such as Windows edition is based on IE etc.

This alone is a major reason to use Carlo[1] instead, which is arguably more secure (by virtue of not using IE) and produces even more lightweight bundles than NeutralinoJS.

1. https://github.com/GoogleChromeLabs/carlo

Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#62

Stupid question: instead of embedding an entire browser in each-and-every app and trying to keep that secure, why not package the native desktop framework as a shared, versioned component and the app as a tiny thing that depends on it?

The appealing thing about Electron was that it shipped a particular version of a particular browser brand, combined with a particular version of a Javascript engine.

Knowing exactly what browser version you're developing for gives you a lot of freedom that you'd lack when having to support different ones.

Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#63
post #51
post #48

I feel like nobody cares too much if they’re running one Electron app; people do have the headroom for an extra 1-2GB of RAM usage. The problem comes when they run several Electron apps at once, and each comes with its own “base” overhead (i.e. the runtime memory consumption of the browser-runtime as a whole, independent of how many render contexts are open.) Chromium is built to share a lot of things between tabs ef…

Where is this 1-2GB number coming from? I'm running a fairly large Electron app and the combined memory usage of its processes is about 250-300MB.

What’s its uptime? A lot of Electron apps—even ones that use minimal local JS, serving mostly as a webview—accrue base overhead as you use them, then keep it around even when you close their main window (and thus release their main Chromium-side render context), as long as the process stays alive. They’re caching stuff (like, as I said, rendered font glyphs, or network responses.)

I have a copy of Slack running that’s using 2GB right now, with no window open.

Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#64
post #51
post #48

I feel like nobody cares too much if they’re running one Electron app; people do have the headroom for an extra 1-2GB of RAM usage. The problem comes when they run several Electron apps at once, and each comes with its own “base” overhead (i.e. the runtime memory consumption of the browser-runtime as a whole, independent of how many render contexts are open.) Chromium is built to share a lot of things between tabs ef…

Where is this 1-2GB number coming from? I'm running a fairly large Electron app and the combined memory usage of its processes is about 250-300MB.

I’m currently running three Electron apps: Spotify, Skype, and VS Code.

Spotify: 1083.7 MB. VS Code: 890.9 MB. Skype: 406 MB.

In the past, I’ve had projects open in VS Code which have caused that number to shoot up into the multi-gigabyte range.

Of course this is all anecdotal but I am pretty sure these numbers come from actual experiences that people are having with Electron apps.

Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#65

using the word "lightweight" to describe anything involving js and an html renderer should be prohibited

I wonder why. Given the popularity of HTML you'd think some large organization would've developed a reasonably fast _and_ memory efficient browser engine by now but everyone seems to be aggressively optimizing for speed.

Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#68
post #61

> There are some drawbacks such as Windows edition is based on IE etc. This alone is a major reason to use Carlo[1] instead, which is arguably more secure (by virtue of not using IE) and produces even more lightweight bundles than NeutralinoJS. 1. https://github.com/GoogleChromeLabs/carlo

Is Carlo maintained? The last commit in master was eight months ago.

Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#69

using the word "lightweight" to describe anything involving js and an html renderer should be prohibited

I wonder why. Given the popularity of HTML you'd think some large organization would've developed a reasonably fast _and_ memory efficient browser engine by now but everyone seems to be aggressively optimizing for speed.

Bloated specs with tons of historical cruft and edge cases. And a renderer needs to support it all. The problem stems from trying to use something designed to share documents with some custom styling as a universal GUI for applications instead.

Re: NeutralinoJS: Lightweight Electron alternative using native browser controls

#70

using the word "lightweight" to describe anything involving js and an html renderer should be prohibited

I wonder why. Given the popularity of HTML you'd think some large organization would've developed a reasonably fast _and_ memory efficient browser engine by now but everyone seems to be aggressively optimizing for speed.

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