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How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

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71–80 of 167 posts

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#71
post #61

I stopped using Allstate years ago -- I mentioned to my agent (this was back when it was still common to actually go see an agent in person to get insurance) that I had a chip in my windshield from a rock and I had to pay to fix it. He said "No, don't pay for it, just make a claim and we'll pay for it no deductable for glass fix since we want you to have a clear windshield". So I made the claim. Then made 2 more clai…

I think high deductibles are an excellent choice for those of us who do well financially. I do that myself. But I should note that 40% of Americans can't handle sudden a $400 expense, so it doesn't work well for everybody: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/nearly-40-of-americans-cant-cov...

Oddly enough, high deductibles also work well for those people who maintain their health and prioritize it financially.

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#72
post #19

> One 36-year-old man from Prince George’s County, Md., who Allstate said in public records should have been paying $3,750 every six months, was instead being charged twice that, more than $7,500. This man was being charged over $15,000/year for auto insurance?

Sounds outrageous but he might be insuring several exotic cars. Obviously, TFA has established that he should be paying less.

I think this makes the most sense. I once looked into getting insurance for a muscle car with a big engine and the quote from one of the insurers was close to $500 per month (much higher than the one I ended up going with). That was many years ago so with inflation and an even faster car like a corvette, someone might easily be paying double that nowadays.

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#73
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just yesterday I looked up something on Amazon. Sent the link to my girlfriend. She saw a price that was $10 more. Out of curiosity, are you and your girlfriend in the same geographic market & served by the same amazon warehouse? And are you both prime members? I wonder if this is personalized to the individual or based on other factors.

We live in the same house. She has Prime , I don’t.

Had the exact same experience back in December with an Echo Flex. I saw a good price, knew my roommate wanted one, so I went downstairs to let him know. His price was $10 higher even though he has Prime and I do not. Same address. The only difference I could think of was that he is a heavy user of multiple Echo devices while I own one that's in its box in a closet. He probably spends at least ten times as much annually with Amazon as I do.

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#74

The best thing you can do is shop for auto insurance every year or two. The longer you stay with a particular company the more likely they are to very slowly and carefully hit you with small rate increases until you're paying far more than their competitors will charge you. Insurance companies understand and exploit consumer behavior better than even the best marketers.

In Italy, auto insurance contracts are limited by law to one year in length, so that people are encouraged to re-evaluate their position and get new quotes more often, promoting competition.

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#75
post #32

Why is the government in the business of disapproving prices in the first place?

Almost all state governments made it so that you can't drive a car unless you have insurance.

The reason they did this is so that if you hit someone and cause physical injury to them or to their property, it's possible to pay them for the damage you did to them.

The government has decided that it is a good idea to make sure that people generally have a way of getting money from people that have caused accidents. We've also decided that it's in our collective best interest to allow people that don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars of cash on hand to be able to drive to the supermarket. However, because of these two conflicting goals, we need a third party that can pay in these cases.

Since it's a legal requirement to give money to a third-party when someone wants to drive, state governments have also determined that it's in our collective best interest to not allow for bad behavior by insurers in overcharging drivers for things not directly related to risk.

The reason for this is that making car insurance generally unaffordable to classes of people tends to exacerbate divisions in society, at least in the United States.

Further, members of minority communities do vote in elections, and will generally not support candidates whose position on insurance companies engaging in price gouging is "the free market will figure it out, sorry you can't afford insurance."

Finally, it cannot be taken for granted that companies always discriminate fairly when there are no laws to prevent them from not doing so. The example we see here is evidence of this. If Allstate is making pricing decisions not based on risk but based on willingness to shop, then that means that people are being unfairly overcharged; it just so happens that it's not as immediately offensive to our morals when it's "willingness to shop" vs. "being a member of a historically discriminated group of people".

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#76
Beautiful commercial material for Allstate competitors and you don't even have to lie or deceive.

A black husband and wife sit by a dinner table:

- Honey, did you see that article on Allstate? I think we may be overpaying...

- Why?

- Well, it says here that Allstate plans to hike prices for the people who pay the most even 20% more, and they call them... suckers.

- What?

- It also says that they plan that for people living in "nonwhite" communities...

- That's us!

- Yeah... who would knew a gecko would be right? We need to call them now, maybe we save 15% or more on car insurance as well...

And then at the closure message: Allstate admits to hiking prices for people who pay the most and calls them suckers. Don't be a sucker, get Geico insurance now!

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#77
post #41

Allstate’s model seemed to determine how much a customer was willing to pay —or overpay—without defecting Welcome to the 21st century. Comcast, Verizon, Toyota, Nabisco - the list goes on and on.

Isn't this how pricing has always worked?

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#78
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you've been with State Farm for over a decade, I would reckon you're getting hosed. State Farm agents only get quote from State Farm - they're not an independent brokerage. When I was shopping around (mid-30's, family, standard 2 cars) in the DFW area, they were the most expensive. Go check out an independent insurance agent. It's not "gaming" it literally takes 20-30 minutes, and could save you $1500 over the who…

That seems like a low time estimate to me, because the products being compared are opaque. What insurers promise they'll do and what they actually do when you need them are not always closely tied. So quickly shopping based on price alone encourages companies to shift from visible to invisible costs.

Car insurance is not that opaque. They are fairly standard policies, with only a few optional items. An independent insurance broker can quickly navigate through these for you.

You're right, though, that what insures promise to do and what they'll do are two different things - its hard to price that in upfront. I don't think the insurer in question, State Farm, is exceptional in that regard either. They dropped a family members coverage after 2 hail storms. They dropped a friend's company's policies after a single claim.

State Farm makes its money by bilking people with it's solo agent model. "Talk to your friendly neighborhood State Farm agent"...who only gets quotes from State Farm.

We would not do that in any other industry. Insurance is a commodity. It's like electronic items. We price hunt Amazon vs. Newegg vs Monoprice because we're nerds, we should do the same thing from our insurance providers.

You don't have to settle on some no-name insurance agency - you can set a high bar, but expanding your marketplace of options from 1 to 5 or 6 can only mean good things for you as a consumer.

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#79
post #61

I stopped using Allstate years ago -- I mentioned to my agent (this was back when it was still common to actually go see an agent in person to get insurance) that I had a chip in my windshield from a rock and I had to pay to fix it. He said "No, don't pay for it, just make a claim and we'll pay for it no deductable for glass fix since we want you to have a clear windshield". So I made the claim. Then made 2 more clai…

I think high deductibles are an excellent choice for those of us who do well financially. I do that myself. But I should note that 40% of Americans can't handle sudden a $400 expense, so it doesn't work well for everybody: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/nearly-40-of-americans-cant-cov...

But for people on lower incomes, why would they be better served with low-deductible (and expensive) policies? If they can't afford a sudden $400 expense, why is spending additional money each month for a more comprehensive policy a good idea? Remember, auto insurance doesn't cover mechanical failures.

A perfectly valid option is to have a higher deductible, and use offset that with putting the funds that would have been needed for the more expensive policy into a general savings account. However, that does require some financial discipline and planning.

And for people who make little enough money where saving that money every month isn't a viable option, they really have no business buying any sort of comprehensive auto insurance anyway. Liability only insurance is far cheaper, and provides all the protection necessary to prevent a car accident from being financially world-ending.

Re: How Allstate’s auto insurance algorithm squeezes big spenders

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We live in the same house. She has Prime , I don’t.

Had the exact same experience back in December with an Echo Flex. I saw a good price, knew my roommate wanted one, so I went downstairs to let him know. His price was $10 higher even though he has Prime and I do not. Same address. The only difference I could think of was that he is a heavy user of multiple Echo devices while I own one that's in its box in a closet. He probably spends at least ten times as much annual…

I guess amazon views prime users as suckers who will pay more.
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