Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records • Hacker News Board

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#351

Post by mentat » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:48 AM UTC

nickjj wrote: post #313

TylerE wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that isn't a useful allocation of resources. Support that powerful are going to basically be devs. With dev salary expectations.

I think it's useful and it's very much worth it to give support a salary where they are enthusiastic to be employed. If someone uses your product or service and has an issue, the first contact they have with your company is through support. A crappy support experience could easily be the difference between having a life time customer valued at thousands of dollars, or your customer feeling frustrated and going to ano…

Part of "Wear the Customer's Shoes" at Twilio (when I was there) was that each quarter every developer and product manager was expected to spend a full day doing front line support for free(-ish) tier customers and however long it took to fully resolve the tickets they got during that time. Really let you understand the type of problems people had, how to have empathy, and basically how to make a better product.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#352

Post by jfkebwjsbx » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:51 AM UTC

jlawer wrote: post #200

jfkebwjsbx wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$20 won't stop anyone with using it. If it is refundable, make it $300. That is high enough that only people and businesses with a showstopper situation will use it.

$300 becomes a pretty high barrier for a lot of people. There a places with decent connectivity where that is a good weeks wages

I was talking within the US economy context. Prices obviously can differ globally.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#353

Post by Hello71 » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:51 AM UTC

MrStonedOne wrote: post #342

Edit: the dns record export/import functionality is hidden behind the advance search drop down for some reason. Ignore this entire comment. From reading the linked helpdoc, apparently your entire domain can get removed from cloudflare if your register stops reporting cloudflare's servers for the ns records. The mere idea of having to re-enter all hundred or so of our dns records using cloudflares 1.2 second delay at…

I googled "cloudflare dns import" and "cloudflare dns export" and the first result both times was an apparently official support article giving step-by-step instructions on how to do so. I myself have used this function about six years ago, so this is not new or untested functionality.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#354

Post by jfkebwjsbx » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:52 AM UTC

herbstein wrote: post #232

basch wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you get it back, the point is to make it a penalty if you are wasting their time.

> But you get it back You're missing the part where some people, that actually would need this support, literally wouldn't be able to find that money because of the difference in purchasing power of the local currency.

Prices can be different for different countries/customers.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#355

Post by donmcronald » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:55 AM UTC

MrStonedOne wrote: post #342

Edit: the dns record export/import functionality is hidden behind the advance search drop down for some reason. Ignore this entire comment. From reading the linked helpdoc, apparently your entire domain can get removed from cloudflare if your register stops reporting cloudflare's servers for the ns records. The mere idea of having to re-enter all hundred or so of our dns records using cloudflares 1.2 second delay at…

You can export a zone file and the auto deletion takes days. You’re site would be offline before the zone gets deleted. I don’t like it a ton, but it’s not even close to what you’re saying.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#356

Post by MrStonedOne » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:57 AM UTC

donmcronald wrote: post #355

MrStonedOne wrote: post #342

Edit: the dns record export/import functionality is hidden behind the advance search drop down for some reason. Ignore this entire comment. From reading the linked helpdoc, apparently your entire domain can get removed from cloudflare if your register stops reporting cloudflare's servers for the ns records. The mere idea of having to re-enter all hundred or so of our dns records using cloudflares 1.2 second delay at…

You can export a zone file and the auto deletion takes days. You’re site would be offline before the zone gets deleted. I don’t like it a ton, but it’s not even close to what you’re saying.

I only have the help article to go on and the fact that their export functionality is for some reason hidden in the advance search drop down? as i've just found out...

Anywho, the help article does not state it it "takes days", so it does not have to "take days". Otherwise known as listening to the documentation not the observed behavior. Programming 101 here.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#357

Post by MrStonedOne » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:58 AM UTC

Hello71 wrote: post #353

MrStonedOne wrote: post #342

Edit: the dns record export/import functionality is hidden behind the advance search drop down for some reason. Ignore this entire comment. From reading the linked helpdoc, apparently your entire domain can get removed from cloudflare if your register stops reporting cloudflare's servers for the ns records. The mere idea of having to re-enter all hundred or so of our dns records using cloudflares 1.2 second delay at…

I googled "cloudflare dns import" and "cloudflare dns export" and the first result both times was an apparently official support article giving step-by-step instructions on how to do so. I myself have used this function about six years ago, so this is not new or untested functionality.

Never clicked that because i have no reason to look for a dns export/import button in the advance search gui... hmm. good to know about, not sure why they put it there.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#358

Post by thayne » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 1:59 AM UTC

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #297

Joakal wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of games theory; if there's no cost to the company to ignore the customer, then that's an incentive to ignore the consumer's complaint. Especially if that company has a monopoly. I can understand why GP suggested company pays $20.

> if there's no cost to the company to ignore the customer Simplifying, that's "if (false)", since ignoring the customers in the limit gets you a failed business and bankruptcy.

not if you have a monopoly. Which is why customer support for most ISPs in the US is so abysmal.

And even if it is just a sufficiently large company, if the customer is not a large payer and the issue is non-trivial to solve, the the cost of losing that customer could very well be less than the cost of fixing the issue.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#359

Post by setr » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 2:02 AM UTC

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #297

Joakal wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of games theory; if there's no cost to the company to ignore the customer, then that's an incentive to ignore the consumer's complaint. Especially if that company has a monopoly. I can understand why GP suggested company pays $20.

> if there's no cost to the company to ignore the customer Simplifying, that's "if (false)", since ignoring the customers in the limit gets you a failed business and bankruptcy.

For the non-enterprise user, isn't this the scenario established today, with no failed business?

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#360

Post by mark_and_sweep » Tue, Feb 25, 2020, 2:07 AM UTC

SahAssar wrote: post #296

cnst wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well, it's also a problem of device manufacturers dropping support for devices too quickly. There are still android 4.1 devices sold on amazon, and you really can't expect web developers to support that. Are you kidding me? If you're looking for shiny stuff to add to your resume, yeah, you can't possibly support those! If you're an HTML5 game developer, yeah, gotta use the latest and greatest. But if you're in the…

The latest version of Android 4.1 was released in 2012. The latest version of chrome for that seems to be around 23. A lot of android 4.1 shipped without TLS 1.1 by default. So you are stuck with SSLv3 or TLSv1. Those are just examples, there's a lot in security that has changed since 2012. A lot of basic security was missing back then, asking anyone to enter any security-sensitive info on those devices now is like t…

A couple of things.. - The tablet is ~5 years old. Even if it was 8 years old, I think you should still be able to order a pizza online. - TLSv1 is far from plaintext. But in any case, the TLS version doesn't matter in this case. The site was loading properly. - Even if the TLS version was outdated, are we now banning people from using the internet for using an older device? - Submitting the form didn't work, the navigation was partially broken. It was probably a JS issue, but I don't know. - The moral of the story, to me, is that, as a web developer, you should also care about those $few% that don't have all the green boxes on caniuse.com. Depending on how many users your site has, this may just be a few people or it might be millions - among them, possibly, your Mom.