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Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

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Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#291

Post by mercora »

iudqnolq wrote: post #271
mercora wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i think that it would be rather unusual to update timestamps in whois (which i guessed the parent poster was referring to) based on updates to in-zone data. A transfer would be an example of something that would change information in whois and thus update the timestamp noted there for the latest update. it is sometime possible to infer the date of the latest change of in-zone data because the serial of the zone is of…

Huh. I definitely didn't make any such changes within the last two weeks. Maybe the whois date got changed because of something opaque and internal to Cloudflare?

yes that is most likely what happened. A change of the nameservers with authority for your zone for example or updates of DNSEC keys would trigger that too, i think. But most commonly it probably happens when the domain gets a renewed registration period or the contact details for some person changed.

btw here are the dates referred in whois for your domain:

  Updated Date: 2020-02-24T20:32:34Z
  Creation Date: 2015-06-09T15:34:37Z
  Registry Expiry Date: 2021-06-09T15:34:37Z
looks like a change has been done even more recently.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#292

Post by lostlogin »

CamelCaseName wrote: post #215
awill wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a really great idea, but I don't think it's possible for this to not get overused for every little issue. Once it's overused, it becomes useless.

I like the setup my bank's Ombudsman has -- you must first take your issue to first level support, then escalate it with them if not resolved. If the second level of support denies you, then and only then can you reach out to the Ombudsman. Any requests that haven't gone through the proper process get auto-rejected.

This may be due to banks having regulatory requirements - they don’t want regulators in. Because of this, resolving issues before regulators are contacted is in everyone’s interest.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#293

Post by lostlogin »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #265
andrewstuart wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've put this idea forward a number of times here on HN in regards to other big tech companies. Technology companies need an "ombudsman" - a contact that customers can go to when the normal tech support processes have failed. The Ombudsman must not be part of the technology companies ordinary support processes, it must be entirely separate, and have highest level authority to demand action within the company. To avoi…

> To avoid the Ombudsman being overused, you could give it a price of say $20, which is always refunded when the case is resolved. HN actually acts somewhat like a crowd-sourced ombudsman. People who have an issue write a description and post it to HN. If enough people find it compelling, it makes the front page. Once it makes the front page, someone in authority at the involved tech company will see it, and try thei…

So maybe HN should be billing them.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#294

Post by Joakal »

foota wrote: post #275
nickjj wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To avoid the Ombudsman being overused, you could give it a price of say $20, which is always refunded when the case is resolved. What if the cost was put onto the business instead of the consumer and the business just hired support people who are all Ombudsmans by default? Instead of focusing on copy / pasting boilerplate scripts and answering as many tickets as possible, they should focus on the problem the custom…

Because requiring the customer to pay a cost fixes the incentives problem. A customer may have an issue that is a minor inconvenience to them, that can either stay as not resolved, is due to error, or is simply not worth resolving to them. By having them pay for fixing the issue it could greatly reduce the number of inbound cases, allowing them to go straight to people that can act on them instead of sitting in triag…

In terms of games theory; if there's no cost to the company to ignore the customer, then that's an incentive to ignore the consumer's complaint. Especially if that company has a monopoly.

I can understand why GP suggested company pays $20.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#295

Post by martin1975 »

scrollaway wrote: post #209
martin1975 wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You guys are the worst censors even on your own blog. Any criticism toward your CEO or the way things have been done, completely out of integrity with your own policies in the past (such as cutting out providers because your CEO woke up self-righteous on the wrong foot that day) gets moderated away or not even admitted to the CF blog. You've screwed up so many times, I am surprised by now more people aren't onto your…

Not a fanboy, still downvoted your post because it's incredibly whiny and does not contribute anything. All you're doing is accuse of censorship without evidence, you say they screwed up "so many times" yet fail to show one example, and then you preemptively accuse people who would dare downvote you to be fanboys. Sorry, but that comment is noise. Mine is too, but hopefully it helps you see things more clearly rather…

He already knows what I'm talking about. And the evidence is out there, just search "Matthew Prince censorship". Abusing 1A rights because he feels like it, hiding under the corporate veil. It's about as un-American as it gets.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#296

Post by SahAssar »

cnst wrote: post #284
SahAssar wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it's also a problem of device manufacturers dropping support for devices too quickly. There are still android 4.1 devices sold on amazon, and you really can't expect web developers to support that. The manufacturer should be required to support it for the full lifetime of the device. Especially since your mom uses it to order stuff, which usually includes some pretty security sensitive information. I think you…

> Well, it's also a problem of device manufacturers dropping support for devices too quickly. There are still android 4.1 devices sold on amazon, and you really can't expect web developers to support that. Are you kidding me? If you're looking for shiny stuff to add to your resume, yeah, you can't possibly support those! If you're an HTML5 game developer, yeah, gotta use the latest and greatest. But if you're in the…

The latest version of Android 4.1 was released in 2012. The latest version of chrome for that seems to be around 23. A lot of android 4.1 shipped without TLS 1.1 by default. So you are stuck with SSLv3 or TLSv1. Those are just examples, there's a lot in security that has changed since 2012.

A lot of basic security was missing back then, asking anyone to enter any security-sensitive info on those devices now is like telling someone to use WinXP and IE8 for online banking. Besides that the great variety of devices that shipped on versions v4.1-v4.4 and with their different hacks/customizations it is simply not feasible to ask developers to support them years after many of them cannot be had to even test a website on, let alone debug it.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#297

Post by asdfasgasdgasdg »

Joakal wrote: post #294
foota wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because requiring the customer to pay a cost fixes the incentives problem. A customer may have an issue that is a minor inconvenience to them, that can either stay as not resolved, is due to error, or is simply not worth resolving to them. By having them pay for fixing the issue it could greatly reduce the number of inbound cases, allowing them to go straight to people that can act on them instead of sitting in triag…

In terms of games theory; if there's no cost to the company to ignore the customer, then that's an incentive to ignore the consumer's complaint. Especially if that company has a monopoly. I can understand why GP suggested company pays $20.

> if there's no cost to the company to ignore the customer

Simplifying, that's "if (false)", since ignoring the customers in the limit gets you a failed business and bankruptcy.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#298

Post by mc3 »

jiggawatts wrote: post #279
jgrahamc wrote: post #83

This is being looked into internally and I am involved. Likely won’t post an update here as it pertains to a customer account (unless customer agrees). BTW If you, dear reader, ever find yourself so frustrated with Cloudflare that you feel like your only recourse is a blog post... my email is jgc@cloudflare.com and I’m happy to hear from people.

Please explain something to me. For me and my of my customers, having your "entire cloud deleted" is like... the #1 nightmare scenario. So why does this capability/function even exist for active accounts at CloudFlare? It sounds like the OP fell victim to what is essentially a regular process. Or to put it another way: No amount of explanation or assurance is ever going to make me feel comfortable with my doctor havi…

Why can you delete DNS records? Well it's pretty common to want to do so (usually followed by adding some new ones).

Your doctor has a syringe as a medical instrument. They can kill if not used correctly.

Re: Cloudflare silently deleted my DNS records

#299

Post by iudqnolq »

mercora wrote: post #291
iudqnolq wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh. I definitely didn't make any such changes within the last two weeks. Maybe the whois date got changed because of something opaque and internal to Cloudflare?

yes that is most likely what happened. A change of the nameservers with authority for your zone for example or updates of DNSEC keys would trigger that too, i think. But most commonly it probably happens when the domain gets a renewed registration period or the contact details for some person changed. btw here are the dates referred in whois for your domain: Updated Date: 2020-02-24T20:32:34Z Creation Date: 2015-06-0…

I believe the latest change happened afterwards when on judge2020's advice I re-added the domain to cloudflare which I think triggered a NS change back to them.
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