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More bosses give four-day workweek a try

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Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess that's another quality of life perk of working outside the US :)

Well, I'd say the opposite... Here you'd be making more money.

I admit to being blissfully ignorant regarding financial matters but isn't 50% less work while earning 33% less (as opposed to 50%) a good thing?

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#282

In a world where no one is compelled to work more than four hours a day, every person possessed of scientific curiosity will be able to indulge it, and every painter will be able to paint without starving, however excellent his pictures may be. Young writers will not be obliged to draw attention to themselves by sensational pot-boilers, with a view to acquiring the economic independence needed for monumental works, f…

This is a funny kind of bubble quote, by someone I think out of touch with most people.

I believe most people would watch TV, play cards, play video games. This is what they already do with their spare time, there's no reason to believe there wouldn't be more of it.

It's amazing what a 'schedule' and 'working with others' and 'requirements' and 'deadlines' can do - it brings people to life and is probably the only way hard things get done.

For a certain kind of person, some free time would lead to a lot of exploration but for most people it would not.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like the idea of working less, but it's going to be hard to use Germany as a poster child. The German economy hasn't been doing to great recently. In my opinion it's largely due to carrying lagging EU economies, but it will be hard to use a struggling economy as a positive indicator Germany: https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/gdp-growth US: https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth

GDP growth is not indicative of a higher standard of living. It just means more things are part of the economy. If I grow my own food and play board games with my family, it doesn't boost the GDP. However, if I go to MacDonald's and then send my kids to daycare while I go to the movies (3 economic transactions), it increases the GDP since those services are now commoditized. Increasing the GDP might boost the standar…

"GDP growth is not indicative of a higher standard of living. "

Whoa there, GDP is absolutely correlated to the standard of living, this is not contentious. That it's not a direct measure, true, but it's definitely 'a' measure. Moreover, growth or contraction in per-capita GDP in a nation is definitely correlated with increasing/reduced economic prosperity even in 'rich' countries. Yes, many things are 'not measured' particularly leisure, but most things of material value are. The GDP is one of the 'least bad' measures we have.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#284
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in NYC, and I have a roughly 1 hour commute each way, but I just take the train everywhere. Of course I can't speak for anyone else, but I find that taking a train to work is a lot less stressful than driving every day. At least on the train, I can read, or pull out my laptop, or just play a video game.

I had the same experience when I lived in NYC. A 45 minute commute on the subway was a lot less stressful than the 45 minute bumper-to-bumper driving commute I do now (in Seattle). I would usually play mindless puzzle games and listen to music on my commute. Other people mention the train delays being stressful, but my company had a standing "subway delays ¯\_(ツ)_/¯" attitude about showing up late. People would show…

I used to live in Renton (by Boeing) and commute into downtown Seattle (5th and Union) and found the light rail in was a good way to deal with it. Over time I found myself using my motorcycle more because I could use the HOV lanes and adjusting my work schedule to get in around 6 and leave by 3:30 (in theory) which went from a guaranteed hour each way to as little as 25min in the morning and about 40 in the afternoon.

Spent a lot of money on REALLY good rain gear and averaged almost 8K mi a year for the four of the five years we were up there. As long as I wasn’t stopped in traffic I felt even more relaxed getting a good motorcycle ride in every morning and being actively zoned out (focused on now instead of life) vs taking the train and being passively zones out with media.

Now that I’m 4mi from my office, come home a few times a week and say hi to the wife at lunch, etc. I will also never go back to anything resembling a commute.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#285
post #18

I can't begin to explain how much less stress I encounter in day to day life having just one week day to stay home. Just having a day to be able to easily knock out chores between Jira issues; drop the car off at the dealer, sell something on craigslist, complete a house project, go to the dentist, meet the handyman, go to the bank, etc is so nice. All of these things wind up on the back burner when I'm in the middle…

Honestly, it just sounds like your job is too stressful. I work 5 days a week, sometimes more, but nobody bats an eye if I need to go somewhere 2 or 3 hours in the middle of the day. I much prefer this to 4 full time days. 5 days of less stress gives you more availability and more flexibility at the same time. I feel it's what we should really be striving for.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I'd say the opposite... Here you'd be making more money.

I admit to being blissfully ignorant regarding financial matters but isn't 50% less work while earning 33% less (as opposed to 50%) a good thing?

Sorry, was only talking about the tax situation. In a progressive system each dollar is taxed at the rate of its bracket. For example (hypothetical), dollars 1-25,000 are taxed at 5%, 25,001-50,000 at 6%, 50,001-75,000 at 7%, etc. You can never gain by making less.

If you actually paid less in taxes on _every_ dollar by dropping a bracket, then you'd have been making more all along in a progressive system. Are you certain that was the case? Just curious.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#287
post #100

I'm a software engineer, I started working 4 days/32 hours per week about a month ago, and I couldn't be happier :)

I started working 4 days/32 hours I think about a decade ago. Never looked back.

I'm going to do that now and fuck what my manager thinks honestly.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#288

I introduced "work from home Wednesday" at our company and the reduction in stress is palpable. Hell, I sleep better on Tuesday nights knowing I've got a day of silence lined up. The naysayers quickly fell in line too, once they realized how much more they could get done that day.

Why Wednesday though?

In addition to OP's reply, I guess it also keeps people from turning it into a long weekend if it's not a Monday or Friday.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#289
post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GDP growth is not indicative of a higher standard of living. It just means more things are part of the economy. If I grow my own food and play board games with my family, it doesn't boost the GDP. However, if I go to MacDonald's and then send my kids to daycare while I go to the movies (3 economic transactions), it increases the GDP since those services are now commoditized. Increasing the GDP might boost the standar…

"GDP growth is not indicative of a higher standard of living. " Whoa there, GDP is absolutely correlated to the standard of living, this is not contentious. That it's not a direct measure, true, but it's definitely 'a' measure. Moreover, growth or contraction in per-capita GDP in a nation is definitely correlated with increasing/reduced economic prosperity even in 'rich' countries. Yes, many things are 'not measured'…

Our comments aren’t conflicting. I was mostly saying that at some point the continued growth of the GDP means turning every aspect of human interaction into an economic interaction, where everything becomes commoditized. Home cooked meals or housing my aging mother aren’t impactful on the GDP like supporting the restaurant and retirement home industries, but I’d say it’s a healthier way of life. A sleepy town may not be booming but I’d prefer it to a high GDP output city.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#290
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that it's hard for some people (managers) to see a relaxed, happy person and believe that they're also totally productive. I don't blame them either; I feel like the image of overly-caffeinated, stressed-out people is embedded in our collective consciousness as representative of High Productivity and our lizard brains can't seem to be able to reconcile that with the data that is saying "relaxed people who mak…

>I feel like the image of overly-caffeinated, stressed-out people is embedded in our collective consciousness as representative of High Productivity Don't forget about the over prescription of amphetamines. I knew I was in a bad place when all the "high performers" (according to management) all had darting eye, chewed gum all day, and were underweight/never ate during the work day.

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