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More bosses give four-day workweek a try

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Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#201

Post by decebalus1 »

lwb wrote: post #133

Something felt fishy about their claim that number of hours worked has been climbing in the United States so I checked their source. It turns out that "average annual hours worked" has changed from 1,780 in 2011 to 1,786 last year. This seems like barely a rounding error... On the other hand, if you look at the FRED website it shows that average annual hours worked has massively decreased in the last 50 years: https:…

> Something felt fishy about their claim that number of hours worked has been climbing in the United States so I checked their source. It turns out that "average annual hours worked" has changed from 1,780 in 2011 to 1,786 last year. This seems like barely a rounding error...

This is a classic case of statistics being used to prove a different point. Perhaps the average annual hours worked is pretty much the same, but the way work happens has changed and it may be harder to quantify. For example, what if there are more part time jobs and people have 2-3 part time jobs? Or how are the hours worked by the flexible hours folks at Starbucks (flexible to be picked by someone else I mean, usually only at peak times). Anecdotally, there's a guy I know who holds a full time job selling insurance, then works afternoons for UPS for the health benefits. How is that reported in 'average annual hours worked' thing?

It's the same as saying that unemployment went down and being happy about it. Because there are so many jobs, some people have 3 in order to pay rent.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#202

Post by erik_landerholm »

mjayhn wrote: post #18

I can't begin to explain how much less stress I encounter in day to day life having just one week day to stay home. Just having a day to be able to easily knock out chores between Jira issues; drop the car off at the dealer, sell something on craigslist, complete a house project, go to the dentist, meet the handyman, go to the bank, etc is so nice. All of these things wind up on the back burner when I'm in the middle…

Do you actually like your job? I don't mean any disrespect, but I've had jobs I don't really like and I get where you are coming from. Right now, though and at other times, since I've had my own companies, 6 day work weeks and 10-12 hrs a day was not even an issue. I feel like if people go to 4 day work weeks, people that love their jobs and are willing to work 1.5times as much or more will have a huge advantage over the long haul.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#203

Post by mortenjorck »

gdubs wrote: post #7

When the 40 hour workweek was first proposed, doomsayers said it would be the end of the American economy. The opposite happened, and as injuries and illness decreased, productivity increased. [1] Something to keep in mind, as it’s counterintuitive and the instinct is to say, “that can never happen here”, or, “it’ll never work.” 1: Robert Gordon, “The Rise and Fall is American Growth”

I'm genuinely impressed that the Overton window on hours seems to have changed since the last time the 4-day work week was in the headlines.

Not that long ago, it was unquestioned that four days meant 4x10. It was simply unthinkable that we would consider less than forty hours "full time." I even skipped this article initially, expecting it to have the same assumptions! And yet, they specifically report that Shake Shack cut back to 32 hours without cutting pay.

I would have expected service-sector jobs to be the last to see something like this. And if a burger chain can do it, an office where we spend 40 hours in a combination of productivity and reading HN can absolutely do it.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#204

Post by the_gipsy »

Ididntdothis wrote: post #191
andrekandre wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I had a manager at a startup tell me that conventional management assumes that engineers will only stay at a company for 18 months, so they really pile on the stress which is ironic, because isn’t that why people stay less and less longer at a company (can’t stand the slog)?

I think economically it may make sense to hire fresh people for less money, burn them out and then have them leave soon. This may be one reason for ageism .

Long term, no. Short term maybe, or it's not "economically" but "politically" desirable.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#205

Post by Dylan16807 »

tasuki wrote: post #156
fjp wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, the one thing I have promised myself is to never have a commute over 35 minutes. I even found a 35 minute commute to an internship in the suburbs disheartening when it was mostly spent sitting in traffic. It's insane to waste that much of your daily life shuttling to your job (if you have an option, which I hope to remain lucky enough to have).

The commute is not the problem, the car is. In Amsterdam I commuted 45 minutes by bike and it was great. I really miss it now that I work from home.

That's better but some days are bad for biking and more than seven hours per week spent on a bike is still a bit much.

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#206

Post by black_puppydog »

philshem wrote: post #126
blackearl wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If not career limiting, pay limiting. I'd worry that I suddenly get a 20% cut in salary

I consider it a 20% bump in time. edit: or is it 25%?!

it's 33%, adding one day to the two of the weekend :)

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#207

Post by wasdfff »

kempbellt wrote: post #172
tombert wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in NYC, and I have a roughly 1 hour commute each way, but I just take the train everywhere. Of course I can't speak for anyone else, but I find that taking a train to work is a lot less stressful than driving every day. At least on the train, I can read, or pull out my laptop, or just play a video game.

I had the same experience when I lived in NYC. A 45 minute commute on the subway was a lot less stressful than the 45 minute bumper-to-bumper driving commute I do now (in Seattle). I would usually play mindless puzzle games and listen to music on my commute. Other people mention the train delays being stressful, but my company had a standing "subway delays ¯\_(ツ)_/¯" attitude about showing up late. People would show…

I sometimes hardly ever have room to pull out my phone during rush hour on the train. Packed like sardines. And they say everyone drives in LA...

Re: More bosses give four-day workweek a try

#210

Post by wasdfff »

mortenjorck wrote: post #203
gdubs wrote: post #7

When the 40 hour workweek was first proposed, doomsayers said it would be the end of the American economy. The opposite happened, and as injuries and illness decreased, productivity increased. [1] Something to keep in mind, as it’s counterintuitive and the instinct is to say, “that can never happen here”, or, “it’ll never work.” 1: Robert Gordon, “The Rise and Fall is American Growth”

I'm genuinely impressed that the Overton window on hours seems to have changed since the last time the 4-day work week was in the headlines. Not that long ago, it was unquestioned that four days meant 4x10. It was simply unthinkable that we would consider less than forty hours "full time." I even skipped this article initially, expecting it to have the same assumptions! And yet, they specifically report that Shake Sh…

Service sector does not want you working 40 hours a week for benefits purposes.
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