People deserve to hear this. Varoufakis has tried to go through the proper channels to make this public. Now DiEM 2025 (his party) has every right to self-publish these recordings. I for one welcome the transparency.
Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
21–30 of 234 posts
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
what happened afterwards to Greece is also pretty shitty
What happened? It's a success story. I get that people do not like the fact that they can't retire now at 55yo or that they had to privatize a few big national companies, but I think it's a perfect example where the doctor knows better than the patient what's best for them.
My understanding of the situation is that German and French banks flooded Greece with easy credit. And as it always happens under such circumstances people/corporations/governments borrowed heavily and when the crisis hit in 2009 they couldn’t repay. All of the so called bailouts have been aimed at making sure French and German banks didn’t suffer and the ones who did suffer have been the Greek people with the exception of the ruling class.
Loans are a two party relationship and people tend to view the borrower more harshly than the lender. Lenders tend to get bailed out and somehow aren’t viewed negatively for their profligate lending. Why is it only the borrowers that suffer?
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#23Earlier quoted context omitted.
What happened? It's a success story. I get that people do not like the fact that they can't retire now at 55yo or that they had to privatize a few big national companies, but I think it's a perfect example where the doctor knows better than the patient what's best for them.
Or a dog who doesn't understand why the vet tortures him!
That's just an insult.
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#24That's a really shitty move. >a USB of the conversations he had secretly recorded while attending a Eurogroup discussion in Brussels People in private converse completely differently (more freely) than in public. Judging people on what they said there by a public standard (it's impossible that this will not happen) is extremely unfair. Especially since Varoufakis knew that he will be recorded, he has probably chosen…
You know what's a shitty move? What the euogroup did to greece and other countries.
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#25Might be worth taking a look at And the Weak Suffer What They Must?. While I still think Varoufakis is a bit too much of a calculated politician, the book is compelling in showing that the treatment imposed on Greece stemmed to an important degree from the creditor state's desire to save their own banks and from cultural animus.
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
What happened? It's a success story. I get that people do not like the fact that they can't retire now at 55yo or that they had to privatize a few big national companies, but I think it's a perfect example where the doctor knows better than the patient what's best for them.
Or a dog who doesn't understand why the vet tortures him!
So now we are implying the the population of a country are less than human, because of economics. Cool!
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#27Sunlight is the best disinfectant. All citizens deserve to know what their politicians are saying behind closed doors.
That type of blanket statement is a great example of theory vs. practice. In theory you’d want everything to be public in the interest of informing your populace. In practice that’s nonsense. There’s genuine national security concerns, forthright debate of alternatives by advisors, and discussions of limits on negotiating positions. Earring on the side of transparency is a good idea but there’s a whole lot in governm…
How can the public take informed decisions if the reasoned debate is always assumed to be held in secret?
OK, national security and foreign negotiation is a special topic where secrecy can be warranted. But if the government of a country or union of countries is considering, say, pay cuts, why on earth would the population not be entitled to hearing all sides of the argument?
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#28[deleted]
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
what happened afterwards to Greece is also pretty shitty
What happened? It's a success story. I get that people do not like the fact that they can't retire now at 55yo or that they had to privatize a few big national companies, but I think it's a perfect example where the doctor knows better than the patient what's best for them.
Retirement age in Greece is today and was in 2011 higher than in Germany. Using some anecdotes and guess for aggregate data is bad induction.
"privatize" means that today all the Greek airports are owned by German companies. Is it legit to suppose there was a slight conflict of interest between the "doctor" and the "patient"?
I mean, would you trust your doctor if he gains on your death?
Re: Varoufakis to Publish Notorious Eurogroup Recordings from 2015 Meetings
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
What happened? It's a success story. I get that people do not like the fact that they can't retire now at 55yo or that they had to privatize a few big national companies, but I think it's a perfect example where the doctor knows better than the patient what's best for them.
My understanding of the situation is that German and French banks flooded Greece with easy credit. And as it always happens under such circumstances people/corporations/governments borrowed heavily and when the crisis hit in 2009 they couldn’t repay. All of the so called bailouts have been aimed at making sure French and German banks didn’t suffer and the ones who did suffer have been the Greek people with the except…
Varoufakis also mentions in his books that German reparation payments to Greece after WW2 were conveniently cancelled by the Western allies when they needed (West) Germany onside to face the Soviets.
https://www.euronews.com/2018/10/10/greece-to-renew-call-for...