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Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

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Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#51

Post by jonathanpierre »

Brakenshire wrote: post #31
taurath wrote: post #19

5% at the moment seems like an incredibly high number to me, at least in the US. I looked it up here, where the stats say a different number: https://www.pymnts.com/apple-pay-adoption/ Also latest is about 51% of merchants have compatible equipment. 1.1% of sales is apple pay. Also usage numbers have gone down from 2018 to 2019. Seems like a puff piece to me?

They’re claiming 5% of global card transactions, that surely can’t be true, there are quite a few developed countries where iPhones are not that common, and countries where other contactless payment systems are already widespread. And what about middle income and poor countries?

I think it might be true on the grounds that credit cards are only king in the US and Latin America, whereas they represent less than 10% of cashless payments in the large markets, namely Asia.

Developed countries have more accessible and cheaper systems, like M-Pesa. In China, you generally just scan a QR code to make a payment. Neither of these systems piggyback on the expensive and slow credit card system.

So, I think this statistic might be as true as it is misleading. Impressive marketshare, just not as big a market.

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#52

Post by JCharante »

rb808 wrote: post #16

Wow I always thought this was a gimmick that no one used, I'll have to evaluate. even 5% doesn't sound right to me (of course the headline is an estimate). > Apple Pay accounts for about 5% of global card transactions and is on pace to handle 1-in-10 such payments by 2025,

Do you also think Android Pay (or is it Google Pay now?) is a gimmick? I highly suggest trying it. It certainly was a gimmick several years ago when I had to pay for my schoolmate whenever we went out to an incompatible-store because he was too stubborn to bring his wallet with him since he could use Android Pay instead.

Now that gas stations and supermarkets everywhere support it I absolute view it as an essential part of life. I just wish that instead of using NFC technology we had adapted QR code payment systems so that paying at dine-in restaurants wouldn't be awkward.

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#53

Post by Cu3PO42 »

notJim wrote: post #39
Cu3PO42 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It rolls a new number every time I use it, Are you positive about this? When I used Apple Pay (in Germany) I always got the same card number. It was my understanding that the number is generated when you add a card to Wallet and is unique to your device, but not transaction. EDIT: The Apple support site [1] claims the following: > Full card numbers aren’t stored on the device or on Apple Pay servers. Instead, a uni…

I thought that you had a fixed number, but Apple generates some kind of unique code, which is sent to the terminal. I.e., the terminal doesn't see your actual number.

I've definitely had the last 4 digits printed out on a receipt. While it is conceivable that those were transmitted separately I find that somewhat unlikely.

I believe tokenization is a feature that is ultimately coming, but not quite there yet (and can also be supported by normal cards).

Disclaimer: I take interest in the payment-world, but am by no means an expert and have made the above claims only to the best of my knowledge.

EDIT: It appears the process of generating the device specific card number is already tokenization.

> After the validation, the card network acting as a TSP (Token Service Provider) creates a token (which is called a DAN or a Device Account Number in the context of Apple Pay) and a token key. This DAN is generated using tokenization and is not the actual card number.

[1] suggests that while some cryptography is done for each transaction, the token is the card number and still only unique to the device, not the transaction.

Said cryptography should be according to the EMV standard [2] and is also performed by a normal card (potentially minus the tokenization).

[1] https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/how-apple-pay-works-under-...

[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMV

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#54

Post by _bxg1 »

notJim wrote: post #17

A big part of this is that apparently US credit card companies decided not to include contactless when they switched over to chip cards, in order to save money. Ironically, contactless was becoming fairly common before the move to EMV, but is now pretty rare. I think about half my cards had it a few years ago, but now none do.

Contactless is also a security concern on actual cards. It only stores a single number (like the stripe, unlike the chips or phone-based NFC), and it effectively "broadcasts" it in a radius of a couple of inches. Very easy to skim even while it's still in your pocket.

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#55

Post by anthonypasq »

Brakenshire wrote: post #31
taurath wrote: post #19

5% at the moment seems like an incredibly high number to me, at least in the US. I looked it up here, where the stats say a different number: https://www.pymnts.com/apple-pay-adoption/ Also latest is about 51% of merchants have compatible equipment. 1.1% of sales is apple pay. Also usage numbers have gone down from 2018 to 2019. Seems like a puff piece to me?

They’re claiming 5% of global card transactions, that surely can’t be true, there are quite a few developed countries where iPhones are not that common, and countries where other contactless payment systems are already widespread. And what about middle income and poor countries?

The U.S. is notoriously behind on this sort of stuff

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#56

Post by cranekam »

Not in Switzerland! Over here pretty much only credit cards work with Apple Pay. I haven't found a single debit card that works with it (other than Revolut, which is only a bank if you squint at it). I assume this is because there is a thing called TWINT [0] here, which covers several payment concepts (peer to peer transfers, point of sale terminals, online) with an equal degree of mediocrity. It's not ubiquitous, fast, or convenient (derp wait while I scan this QR code instead of using NFC). I'd love to be able to use Apple Pay.

[0] https://www.twint.ch/en/

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#57

Post by kelnos »

Not to hijack, but I'm really curious to see how this compares with Google Pay adoption and growth rate. Devices capable of Google Pay are likely more prevalent (well, maybe; there could be a lot of old Android devices out there that don't support it), but I wonder if there are similar trends as with the Apple App Store and Google Play Store, where customers of the former are much more likely to spend money.

It would be interesting to possibly make some generalizations about how much money Apple vs. Android users spend in general, even outside their respective app stores. Maybe not useful generalizations, but I'm interested nonetheless.

(I say this as an Android user who loves Google Pay and wishes it were available for web-based payments like Apple Pay is.)

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#58

Post by ghaff »

mrosett wrote: post #15

I thought Apple pay was really dumb... and then I started using it. Especially with an Apple Watch: when I get to checkout, I can fumble with my wallet, dig out a card, wait ten seconds for the chip to read, and then put the card away.... or I can tap a button on my watch twice and wave it near the reader. Done.

It's nice when traveling with an Apple Watch outside the US. I can do transactions without the whole "sigh, I need to find a pen so this American can sign a receipt." (There's a fairly low limit to Apple Pay transactions for US accounts in some places but it's still nice to pick up a few items in a grocery store.)

Re: Apple Pay on pace to account for 10% of global card transactions

#59

Post by jdminhbg »

taurath wrote: post #19

5% at the moment seems like an incredibly high number to me, at least in the US. I looked it up here, where the stats say a different number: https://www.pymnts.com/apple-pay-adoption/ Also latest is about 51% of merchants have compatible equipment. 1.1% of sales is apple pay. Also usage numbers have gone down from 2018 to 2019. Seems like a puff piece to me?

I have no idea if 5% is correct, but worth noting that 1.1% figure is total sales, not including online. The article is about total credit card transaction volume.
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