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Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

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Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#171
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Senior roles in SF/NY pay >600k in total comp. I was flat out told there are no such jobs in Canada two years back. Has that changed?

Yes, that has changed.

Could you please name a couple of places that do? A lot of people I know would definitely appreciate this knowledge.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#172
post #2

The cheap labour pool as a consequence of the weak Canadian dollar certainly helps, alongside having identical time zones and nearly identical culture to the United States. Lots of Canadian consultancies butter their bread with USD.

>> nearly identical culture to the United States. Lol. Maybe a similar culture to some parts of California or Washington, and that is a stretch, but Vancouver is very very different than "the United States". Live in both for a while and all the little difference (the guns, health care, government, police, civil-military relations, the environment, land use, education etc) add up to markedly different approaches to li…

I, too, would accept "similar culture," but it is far from "nearly identical." I say this as a Canadian who lived in the United States for several years.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quality of life is subjective, and there are no cities that offer as much financial and career opportunity to the average senior software developer as SV does right now. Yes, cost of living is high, but you’ll still come out far ahead the average senior software dev living in some midwestern city. There are exceptions / edge cases, but they’re just that.

> you’ll still come out far ahead the average senior software dev living in some midwestern city Come out far ahead how? I'm already pulling close to 6 figures, and I expect to reach $120-130k in a relatively short time period. Do I -need- to move to SV and live in much shittier conditions and have an insane cost of living just to earn some more money? ... I feel that remote work makes this an outdated concept (my co…

Silicon Valley tech companies pay something like $400-$500k if you're good enough and have 10 years experience. It goes up from there as well but it's harder to get those promotions. I also know people who made that much at 25-ish due to good negotiation (at a pre-IPO late stage startup) or were in a hot field (ML). That's not counting the usual startup lottery.

That money can offset cost of living quiet easily.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#174
post #107

As a Candian, it seems to me so very pathetically and predictably Canadian to literally herald the surrender of your own industries to foreign takeover. Canada is (often) to tech what Mexico is to cars. Mexican 'assembly' of cars is fine and good, but they don't exactly move up the value chain from there. Canada produces a lot of decent tech people, who will work for 2/3 the wages, unfortunately, this doesn't map to…

> Now, that's a hard thing to contemplate, as 'nobody' can really compete with SV at their own game As in total aggregate, I agree. On a per-capita basis, no. Some countries have a very healthy tech sector without being as large as in the US. Canada does not not need to have FAANG, just an F is enough.

Very true, but we don't have an 'F'.

An 'F' generally requires a critical mass of competitive expertise in certain areas, along with the 'F' (and smaller entities) to commercialize it. Basically an 'industrial hub'.

Sweden, Switzerland have F-like companies, but also the surrounding competitive base (and often direct participation of government) to support them.

Switzerland is very competitive in drugs, among many other things.

Interesting example: Sweden makes Fighter Jets (Grippon), maybe the most sophisticated of all product categories.

Making 'Fighter Jets' requires a highly specialized industrial base, and the investment/cooperation of government: Jet sales are done as much through the diplomatic corps as anything else. Policy is shaped around it.

But how did Sweden get there? Well, because they're a sovereign nation and have fought several wars with Russia, 'everyone serves' as part of their community requirements. In the 1960's tiny Sweden had one of the largest air forces in the world! So, out of this (and other developments), they have the ability to make advanced fighters.

So it's a panacea of cultural elements and underpinning institutions that enable exceptional entities.

The problem with what I have just described, is that it 'does not compute' in the American, neoliberal model. In America, entrepreneurs 'raise money' and 'make companies' and 'many fail, but some win'. This kind of neoliberal model is heralded as the 'true free-market solution', but in reality, it disproportionately favours very large countries.

Smaller nations have to play a different game.

The Canadian elite has mostly bought into the neoliberal model, even most 'progressives'. So Canada s a small country, caught up in playing from the American ideological playbook.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#175
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First off: I have lived & worked in Munich and done exactly what you describe (now live in the countryside working for a remote company) but it is still only a minority of people who [can] do that. It is certainly not the case that everybody is doing it. The ecosystem is alive and well. In my various data sources tracking job advertising, Munich has been and continues to be where almost all of the interesting jobs ar…

How is €80k an extremely high salary in Germany when a nice apartment in Munich is closing on €800k? Fells like a place with Bay Area prices but without the pay.

According to the UBS Real Estate Bubble Index 2019 [0], Munich is the city with the highest property bubble risk...So your perception of "Fells like a place with Bay Area prices but without the pay" holds some truth.

[0]: https://www.ubs.com/global/en/wealth-management/chief-invest...

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no transparency on what the roles will be. Engineering? Accounting? Datacenter operations? Fly fishing?

It's obviously going to be mostly engineering, it's Google.

The only mention I've been able to find online suggest that only about 1/3 of Google's workforce are in R&D: https://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-Google-employees-ar...

"This information is most likely buried in Google’s annual report — the last one I could dig up is their 2015 fiscal year end report. According to the paper published by Google Inc and Alphabet Inc, there are 61,814 full-time employees with 23,336 in research and development."

Bear in mind R&D isn't pure developers. It also includes QA and project/program management roles.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#177
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's because of things like https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/se... So while there certainly is a skilled worker immigration path, if you are accepted by the board as a refugee, you will be met with help and kindness. And even while waiting, we do not separate kids from you and put them in cages. And we accept the most refugees in the world: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-48696974

> you will be met with help and kindness How is that different than the U.S.? Are refugees not met with help and kindness in America? > And even while waiting, we do not separate kids from you and put them in cages While I do not agree with this tactic, I also think that this paints an unfair picture, since Canada has never experienced immigration issues to the degree that the U.S. has. Maybe the U.S. should do what…

America historically greeted refugees with kindness. This changed significantly with the new administration in 2017.

The US Asylum backlog jumped to 340,000 - up 10x since 2014. Certainly some of that is due to heightened applications, but a lot is due to antiquated systems in USCIS and political changes.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/u-s-claims-reducing-re...

I’d also note in the Syrian refugee crisis, that Canada punched high above its weight in resettlement, far beyond the numbers the USA accepted, for a country 10x smaller.

With global warming and conflict on the rise, we are about to see over a billion people displaced over the next 50 years. In prior eras, the US would have led global efforts to manage this in a structured, humane way. But lately the US has preferred dismantling the global order and institutions it created after WW2.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Senior roles in SF/NY pay >600k in total comp. I was flat out told there are no such jobs in Canada two years back. Has that changed?

What do you mean by "senior roles"? Something like a "Senior Software Engineer"? (or more like a Senior Staff SWE / director) Can guarantee Senior Software Engineers don't make >600K in SF.

SSE can make ~ $600K in SF for FANG.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#179
Tech salaries in Canada are very low and I really hope this will raise the bar for everybody. Most of the talent (outside of Quebec) migrates south of the border at some point, because it makes no financial sense to stay. Innovation outside of Toronto is low/inexistent and it is hard to get funding. I am always amazed when founders make the national news here when they raise 1-2M$ CAD. At the same time, you have CEOs complaining that the video game industry is poaching dev unfairly (because the salaries are subsidized) instead of raising their own salaries... It really is a sad state. It might be due to the fact that we have a culture of small/medium businesses that are very slow to adopt new technologies and a mentally of what we called in french "born for small bread". At the same time, since nobody is really making a lot of money you also have a more equal society leading to a better quality of life IMO (less crime, more generosity, etc).

As a new grad myself, I am in this situation where I get offers of >120k USD if I move to SV with a growth potential (both in technical and financial terms) far better than what I can get here. In Quebec (where I live), I saw most of my peers stay around and accept salaries ranging from 65k CAD to 80k CAD (50k-61k USD). From what I know, an average senior can expect 120-130k CAD in Montreal. The only way to make more is by being a consultant, which is why you see a lot of them around here (for better or worse). I would feel a bit guilty to move to the US right now considering I got basically a free education and I do want to contribute back to society.

Re: Google's expansion plans show why Canada's tech boom is here to stay

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but not everybody can get to this level of compensation even in SF If you can grow, you'll grow pretty much everywhere I know the 600k sound tempting but it's not like it doesn't have any strings attached. Getting paid, let's say 200k USD in Canada, might get you closer to owning your home than the 600k in SF

Gosh if you just save that salary for 5 years in the US you wont need to work for life.

Legitimately one of the reasons it’s hard to keep top talent: they save for a few years and either retire or start their own companies.
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