Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers • Hacker News Board

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#171

Post by Dylan16807 » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 10:42 AM UTC

kazinator wrote: post #103

But, on its way to the Moon, how would that Cortex M0 fare against cosmic radiation? One bad bit stops the show. The smaller are your transistors, the more they are susceptible to impact from a particle.

That particular chip, probably badly. But you can buy a rad-hardened M0 with similar specs: https://www.voragotech.com/products/va10820 The price is under a thousand dollars, too.

NASA's also working on a hardened A53 at ~800MHz, and you can get hardened POWER chips at similar frequencies.

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#172

Post by clarry » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 11:44 AM UTC

seszett wrote: post #163

lunias wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot: Would you like a receipt? (wait) It makes no sense at all. As soon as you input payment it should output gas. There's really no need for buttons or a screen at all (well, maybe except for entering a zip). If they really have to show all that stuff, it can come after I have my gas. Note: languages aren't slow, it's the programs that are slow.

I'm a bit surprised to see the comments here on automated gas station pumps. I've used quite a few different ones in a few different countries of Europe (where I go outside Europe, usually the stations are not automated so I can't compare) and I have never had this kind of slow experience. Here in Belgium I don't even get asked if I want a receipt, I can just ask it afterwards if I like (just like for the rewards car…

> But the interface itself always asks for the least possible things. Diesel/gasoline 95/gasoline 98 then the card PIN, and you can fill up.

In Finland, they don't even ask what you're going to pump. You just grab the right nozzle and go.

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#173

Post by folli » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 12:32 PM UTC

lunias wrote: post #134

xp84 wrote: post #114

I'd like to also see an article examining these computing power attributes on the piece of garbage embedded computer on the front of the gas pumps where the lag between registering every keypress is like 800ms, and every screen redraw takes about 2000ms. It takes me an extra 60 seconds to get gas now thanks to how slow these things are, and it is nearly universal despite whether they appear to be 20 year old or new d…

You forgot: Would you like a receipt? (wait) It makes no sense at all. As soon as you input payment it should output gas. There's really no need for buttons or a screen at all (well, maybe except for entering a zip). If they really have to show all that stuff, it can come after I have my gas. Note: languages aren't slow, it's the programs that are slow.

As a non-US citizen: What's the deal with entering ZIP codes in some gas stations in the US? Tax reasons?

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#174

Post by masklinn » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 12:33 PM UTC

Dylan16807 wrote: post #169

masklinn wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes because the AGC was well known for its smoothly scrolling message lists on its large high-density display.

Are you actually trying to argue that smooth scrolling is hard, and specifically because of the display size? On the CPU side, you can figure out how to position a line of text in less than 100 instructions if you store it right. But even if you use 10 million instructions to lay out a handful of lines, you'll never have to hitch. On the GPU side, the pre-retina A5 had a fill rate of 2 billion pixels per second, and…

> Are you actually trying to argue that smooth scrolling is hard, and specifically because of the display size?

What I'm arguing is that the problems have little to do with one another, and I'm guessing so do the means. That's like saying building a viaduct is easy because the pyramids exist.

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#175

Post by tylergetsay » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 12:39 PM UTC

folli wrote: post #173

lunias wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot: Would you like a receipt? (wait) It makes no sense at all. As soon as you input payment it should output gas. There's really no need for buttons or a screen at all (well, maybe except for entering a zip). If they really have to show all that stuff, it can come after I have my gas. Note: languages aren't slow, it's the programs that are slow.

As a non-US citizen: What's the deal with entering ZIP codes in some gas stations in the US? Tax reasons?

Fraud protection

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#176

Post by masklinn » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 12:43 PM UTC

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #161

thombat wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But do you also give them a free hand to implement the entire stack below to meet that goal, along with the budgeting advice "waste anything but time"?

That is overkill, and in the end they manage to deliver an acceptable results. You see, the problem of app developers, especially in big companies, is that they are given a top-notch smartphones, so they naturally target such hardware as a benchmark for performance, which moves every year. That's why a 2016 Moto Z play smartphone ran smoothly in 2016, but works really slow in 2020 - because all the regular apps (Gmai…

Have you considered maybe giving them test phones with the configurations they're supposed to support instead of "scolding" them like misbehaving children because they're apparently working with the phones they have but supposed to magically support phones they don't?

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#177

Post by kemotep » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 12:44 PM UTC

folli wrote: post #173

lunias wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot: Would you like a receipt? (wait) It makes no sense at all. As soon as you input payment it should output gas. There's really no need for buttons or a screen at all (well, maybe except for entering a zip). If they really have to show all that stuff, it can come after I have my gas. Note: languages aren't slow, it's the programs that are slow.

As a non-US citizen: What's the deal with entering ZIP codes in some gas stations in the US? Tax reasons?

From what I understand it is for fraud protection. If you steal a credit card you likely do not know what the billing zip code is.

According to this blog[0] they also collect the data for "marketing purposes".

[0]:https://blogs.creditcards.com/2014/05/zip-codes-gas-station-...

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#178

Post by RivieraKid » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 1:01 PM UTC

overgard wrote: post #116

This is brilliant and hilarious, but, as a person that cares about this I honestly have no idea what to do. Fighting software waste feels like getting in a fistfight with the ocean or something. I could write everything in C or assembly, I don't even think that notion is crazy , but my client's want javascript. Not that it's even javascripts fault, or any particular languages fault, I just don't know how you convince…

Interesting, I see absolutely no problem with this. There's no reason to use worse chips in USB-C chargers, because the cost savings would be minimal and possibly outweighed by software development costs.

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#179

Post by numpad0 » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 1:11 PM UTC

folli wrote: post #173

lunias wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot: Would you like a receipt? (wait) It makes no sense at all. As soon as you input payment it should output gas. There's really no need for buttons or a screen at all (well, maybe except for entering a zip). If they really have to show all that stuff, it can come after I have my gas. Note: languages aren't slow, it's the programs that are slow.

As a non-US citizen: What's the deal with entering ZIP codes in some gas stations in the US? Tax reasons?

I’ve heard it’s a substitute solution for billing address textbox for that interface

Re: Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs. USB-C Chargers

#180

Post by numpad0 » Sat, Feb 08, 2020, 1:21 PM UTC

Goz3rr wrote: post #146

kumarvvr wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even my car has a touchscreen that requires, on average about 1 second to register a touch. I mean, a replacement capacitive touch screen for my samsung mobile is like 2000 Rs. (30 USD) Its frustrating how far we have come and yet how behind we are.

I doubt your average phone screen would be happy being left in 80+ °C for prolonged periods of time. Automotive grade exists for a reason, as Tesla[1] found out the hard way. [1]: https://www.thedrive.com/tech/27989/teslas-screen-saga-shows...

That’s not an excuse for shitty experience, that’s materials cost/part performance justification. Think first-gen iPhone: by now it’s worse in performance compared to better infotainment, but infotainment still sucks.