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SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

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Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#91

Post by CM30 »

sixhobbits wrote: post #87

Why do these SEO people write so dramatically? Why do they use such short sentences and short paragraphs? Want to know? It's simple. They fall fowl of Goodhart's law! But what's that? I'll tell you! Goodhart's law states 'When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.' That's a lot of words, and it's really complicated, so let's simplify! Stay with me -- I'll teach you. We can learn together. You're…

For the short sentences and paragraphs thing, I think it's about readability more than anything. People tend to scan content when they read online, not go through word by word, and it's probably easier to do that with short sentences and paragraphs.

It's also likely in part down to them optimising for readability tests. Stuff like Yoast grades your content based on the results of a Flesch-Kincaid readability test, which marks it as easier to read if there are less words and syllables per sentence, with the recommended score being roughly equivalent to a grade 8 reading level. Hence these SEO writers are basically writing for 13-14 year olds.

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#92

Post by sessy »

sixhobbits wrote: post #87

Why do these SEO people write so dramatically? Why do they use such short sentences and short paragraphs? Want to know? It's simple. They fall fowl of Goodhart's law! But what's that? I'll tell you! Goodhart's law states 'When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.' That's a lot of words, and it's really complicated, so let's simplify! Stay with me -- I'll teach you. We can learn together. You're…

Probably time to bring this up again: The internet is an SEO landfill. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20256764

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#93

Post by lowdose »

puranjay wrote: post #88
lowdose wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you elaborate on the specific difference?

Think of these three articles: 1. How to Choose the Right Project Management Software This is keyword focused - "project management software". Our only objective with this article is to rank for this keyword while also sharing useful advice for search users on how to go about choosing a project management tool. 2. 25 Project Management Experts Share Their Favorite PM Tips This is (mostly) social sharing focused. If y…

Especially number 2 gave a new insight thank you!

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#94

Post by shill_predictor »

sixhobbits wrote: post #87

Why do these SEO people write so dramatically? Why do they use such short sentences and short paragraphs? Want to know? It's simple. They fall fowl of Goodhart's law! But what's that? I'll tell you! Goodhart's law states 'When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.' That's a lot of words, and it's really complicated, so let's simplify! Stay with me -- I'll teach you. We can learn together. You're…

I've got the urge to kick you in the balls while reading it. You have really represented a problem with this writing style.

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#95

Post by WA »

sixhobbits wrote: post #87

Why do these SEO people write so dramatically? Why do they use such short sentences and short paragraphs? Want to know? It's simple. They fall fowl of Goodhart's law! But what's that? I'll tell you! Goodhart's law states 'When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.' That's a lot of words, and it's really complicated, so let's simplify! Stay with me -- I'll teach you. We can learn together. You're…

I think it's called direct response copywriting and mimics a more conversational style.

I know, you wanted to make a negative example and yes, this writing style gets old pretty fast. However, for a moment it works surprisingly well. And in a way the value you provide with that style is that the point you want to get across sticks better somehow.

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#96

Post by rchaud »

anarazel wrote: post #83
noelceta wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the case, actually. Your content should be based on the intent of the search. For example, if someone's Googling "how to improve a process," they're looking for practical advice on improving processes. They're NOT looking for "benefits of process improvement," "why you should improve your processes," etc. Sure, you can write the BEST article on one of these topics, but it's not going to rank because that's…

Imo this is one of the reasons why content on the web has become so much shallow.

It's free, so what do you expect?

If you were at the mall and picked up a pamphlet about say, philosophy from someone handing them out at the food court, would you complain that it didn't have the same depth as something you'd find at a bookstore?

We've accustomed ourselves to believing that collections of words should be free if they're on the Internet, when that has almost never been true in the real world.

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#97

Post by rchaud »

technion wrote: post #75
tilolebo wrote: post #12

> The main issue was that the writers weren’t SEO specialists: they knew how to write good content, but good content is NOT always the same as SEO content. > The main difference between SEO content and generic content is that the first is written with user search intent in mind. You need to keep in mind what the Googler is looking for when they search for any given keyword. Then, you create content based on that inte…

I keep in mind when seeing these statements that the entire SEO industry is built around convincing people web developers shouldn't develop websites (it can't rank without an SEO expert), mechanics shouldn't write guides on cars (an SEO is better qualified) and so on. The fact half the SEO guides out there either contradict Google's advice, or rate most top search sites horribly should also be considered. I'm not say…

> I keep in mind when seeing these statements that the entire SEO industry is built around convincing people web developers shouldn't develop websites

Can you point to an example of this? SEO doesn't matter at all for devs working on web applications like Salesforce or TurboTax; they are their own walled garden. For devs that work on the CMSs of "content" sites like NYT, Buzzfeed etc, the only technical recommendation an SEO would offer would be to:

- adhere to principles of web accessibility

- HTTPS site wide

- implement caching, load assets via CDN, use srcset for images to improve site speed

- use semantic HTML (, , etc, not just )

- a logical URL structure (/articles/economy/us-gdp-Q4-2019) and information architecture

These are things that most devs already know they should implement.

The bulk of SEO work is organizing existing content so they perform better on search. This could mean rearranging the IA, consolidating content into a longer-form "guide" that can be backlinked on another site and evaluating if content is using the keywords that people search for.

None of those tasks require developers, as the functionality is usually available as an option in the CMS.

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#98

Post by rchaud »

Alir3z4 wrote: post #89

I hate any SEO case study and companies that want to make it happen for you. Just write content that help people and solve people problem. Have you seen how Digital Ocean has lots of useful tutorials and articles, they get tons of visits and lost of customers and exposures, they solve people problem. How about StackOverflow ? is the content written with SEO in mind ? No, they solve people problem, problem that people…

You are using 2 examples that couldn't be more different.

Digital Ocean's tutorials are often written by third party contributors, not DO staff. Those third parties are doing their own SEO by linking to their own websites, if you haven't noticed. It's a win-win for both DO and the writers.

Having set up a few DO droplets, I'll say that the documentation around their own services is less than great, and I often find myself Googling how to do this or that in DO and finding help on third party sites.

StackOverflow is like Facebook or Reddit; it's all user-generated content. SO staff don't contribute besides moderating the discussions. SO does well on SEO because it's been around for a long time, and the content is set up in a question and answer form, which is tailor made for search engines.

Re: SEO case study: 8k to 200k monthly organic traffic

#99

Post by technion »

rchaud wrote: post #97
technion wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep in mind when seeing these statements that the entire SEO industry is built around convincing people web developers shouldn't develop websites (it can't rank without an SEO expert), mechanics shouldn't write guides on cars (an SEO is better qualified) and so on. The fact half the SEO guides out there either contradict Google's advice, or rate most top search sites horribly should also be considered. I'm not say…

> I keep in mind when seeing these statements that the entire SEO industry is built around convincing people web developers shouldn't develop websites Can you point to an example of this? SEO doesn't matter at all for devs working on web applications like Salesforce or TurboTax; they are their own walled garden. For devs that work on the CMSs of "content" sites like NYT, Buzzfeed etc, the only technical recommendatio…

I completely agree you provided a list of things Devs should know already. My point is that it's the exact same list of stuff that has shown up every single SEO sales pitch I have ever seen.
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