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When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

krebsonsecurity.com

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Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#61

Post by myself248 »

gambler wrote: post #10

People are now beginning to realize that cellphones send out too much data. Well, modern cars are far worse. Do you know that some of them have weight sensors in seats? Do you know that they send this info out? On your phone, you at least have some control. You have zero control over your car's cell connection. I'm not even sure you can disable over-the-wire updates.

Pull the SIM card, or if it's an eUICC cut the trace. Yank the antenna wire, cap it with a terminator. Cut the module off the bus if you feel like pulling the fuse isn't enough.

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#62

Post by z2 »

gambler wrote: post #10

People are now beginning to realize that cellphones send out too much data. Well, modern cars are far worse. Do you know that some of them have weight sensors in seats? Do you know that they send this info out? On your phone, you at least have some control. You have zero control over your car's cell connection. I'm not even sure you can disable over-the-wire updates.

Agree, and if I may add, I think cars are worse because their primary function (transport) hasn't changed nearly enough compared with that of phones (voice calls into computation/information-at-fingertips). Therefore, it's harder to justify the same exponential increase in complexity and 'smart'. Maybe OTA hardware tuning ala Tesla will prove me wrong in the future...

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#63

Post by empath75 »

tyho wrote: post #13

BMW is also massively insecure. My "secret token" I had to enter on my phone to link it with the car was the VIN number. That number is physically stamped into the engine block and chassis so obviously cannot be changed, even after I sell the car. I also suspect these numbers are sequential. Till this car is scrapped I will be able to locate it, turn on the AC, unlock the doors etc.

So wait if I see a new bmw, all I need to do to break in is download the app and put in the VIN?

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#64

Post by o_____________o »

nemosaltat wrote: post #54
vearwhershuh wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if your 1980s SUV is capable of reaching speeds that might kill you. I will simply be maimed horribly and die later in the hospital, screaming "AT LEAST MY DEATH WASN'T TRACKED BY ALEXA". I am, on balance, comfortable with this fate. Alexa: His death was, in fact, tracked by Alexa

I’m hearing that last sentence in the voice of the narrator from arrested development.

Ron Howard! Director of A Beautiful Mind, Apollo 13, Willow, etc., star of Happy Days, father of Bryce Dallas Howard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70nqLIj6l_M

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#65

Post by kube-system »

gumby wrote: post #38
kube-system wrote: post #2

Yikes. This is a serious safety issue. Imagine if this wasn’t an EV, and someone started a car while in the new owner’s garage.

Fortunately it’s almost impossible to kill yourself by running the car in the garage any more.

You're more likely to survive now, but it's definitely nowhere near an impossibility. There are tons of stories in the news on a regular basis of people who left their cars running accidentally and died of CO poisoning, mostly elderly who likely didn't realize they left it running.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/13/business/deadly-convenien...

Also, catalytic converters don't actually work until they're at operating temperatures.

https://www.abe.iastate.edu/extension-and-outreach/carbon-mo...

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#66

Post by ta999999171 »

scarejunba wrote: post #41
correct_horse wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same could be said of any 2020 SUV. Cars are dangerous.

New cars are way safer than the ones from the 1980s, though. In just a risk-minimization strategy I prefer a new car with Alexa over a forty year old car without. The privacy risk is low with the new one, but the death risk is high with the old one. Rolled my car and I just crawled out of the wreck and walked away with a mild concussion.

You must not be a journalist.

Also, the best way to reduce risk for you would be to let someone else drive.

It takes a LOT to roll a street car these days, holy hell.

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#67

Post by Enginerrrd »

speedgoose wrote: post #15
kube-system wrote: post #2

Yikes. This is a serious safety issue. Imagine if this wasn’t an EV, and someone started a car while in the new owner’s garage.

Can you start a ICE vehicle remotely? I thought it was mostly a EV thing, some people have aftermarket kits.

Yes, and this is super common.

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#68

Post by gassit »

tyho wrote: post #13

BMW is also massively insecure. My "secret token" I had to enter on my phone to link it with the car was the VIN number. That number is physically stamped into the engine block and chassis so obviously cannot be changed, even after I sell the car. I also suspect these numbers are sequential. Till this car is scrapped I will be able to locate it, turn on the AC, unlock the doors etc.

I believe this is not quite correct, there is an additional step. Once you enter the VIN BMW ConnectedDrive will send a message to the car which you have to retrieve through the iDrive interface before it will 'pair' with online services or the app. You need to have physical access to the car.

And if you sell the car and it is added to another ConnectedDrive account (or BMW mark it as sold) it disappears from your dashboard and you need physical access again to add it.

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#69

Post by JohnFen »

scarejunba wrote: post #41
correct_horse wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same could be said of any 2020 SUV. Cars are dangerous.

New cars are way safer than the ones from the 1980s, though. In just a risk-minimization strategy I prefer a new car with Alexa over a forty year old car without. The privacy risk is low with the new one, but the death risk is high with the old one. Rolled my car and I just crawled out of the wreck and walked away with a mild concussion.

> The privacy risk is low with the new one

Why do you say that? The new cars are constantly sending telemetry to the mothership.

Re: When Your Used Car Is a Little Too ‘Mobile’

#70

Post by judge2020 »

h2odragon wrote: post #22

I'm thankful our 2004 & 2002 cars are as free of "smart" as they are. They're aging out on us and we've been looking at replacements; the used market is contaminated with screens and systems that we DO NOT WANT. I wonder how difficult it will be to strip all that shit out when the time comes. What's going to have to be stubbed out or emulated to make the car run and how difficult will that be? Are we looking at thing…

Cars manufactured starting May 2018 must have backup cameras, so chances are whatever car you get will also have infotainment and other features. Maybe there are a few cars that have a pop-up screen or something similar that is only used for backup.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backup_camera#Mandates

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