The education entrepreneur Adam Robinson did his own survey a few decades ago. He found that while children of two immigrants did better on standardized tests than children of two non-immigrant parents, the "best" combination came from having an immigrant father and a non-immigrant mother. ("Best" when focusing solely on standardized test results)
Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
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Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#42Like father, not like son https://archive.vn/YIjwk
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#43It's particularly interesting to look at the mobility statistics of asian americans (many of whom are also immigrants) as a category: http://www.equality-of-opportunity.org/assets/documents/race... . If you look at table 1 on page 56, you can see that for white americans, the probability of a child ending up in the top quantile of income where a parent is in the bottom quantile of income is 11% (about half the probab…
I wonder how much of this comes from insulation from cultural trends that seem to try to push away every cultural norm in favor of something else. I’d imagine immigrant families that haven’t fully assimilated into all that are less influenced.
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
Something that many HNers will probably be embarrased to admit being surprised by is how higher education attainment rates for immigrants don't exclude African immigrants. In fact, black immigrants from Africa and the West Indies have among the highest degree attainment rate of any group. This belies the lower college-and-advanced-degree attainment rate for black Americans as a whole. All of this seems to suggest tha…
Most of the reason for immigrant children doing so well is the fact that immigrants are often more driven, ambitious, and at the top of their peer group. So the USA gets a biased sample of immigrants from countries like Nigeria. None of this is happening in a vacuum, and interpreting it as such is misguided propaganda.
Correct. A self-selecting sample if there ever was one.
Immigrating and deciding to live in another country takes a lot determination.
If you take ambitious and motivated black parents in America I am quite sure their children far outcompete the averages.
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#45Earlier quoted context omitted.
How do you define weak and strong, though?
I think of it as resiliance to adversity. If someone has had a comparatively easy life, they'll probably have a harder time dealing with difficult situations. The problem is that everything is relative, so people may not see their life as easy, even if it is compared to most people. For example, I used to work with someone who was raised by wealthy parents, went to super exclusive private schools, and had multiple co…
people just need to leave their comfort zone occasionally
It would be nice if that happened, though. You tell your students, 75 % of whom have no grasp of 8th-grade math, that they have been cheated out of an education and that consequently they now need to work twice as hard. But instead of knuckling down they all march off to the Dean to complain. Of course the Dean enables the underperformance.
You can't frame "easy life" only in terms of money, "easy life" also means coasting through an underperforming school and never having to face reality.
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#46It's particularly interesting to look at the mobility statistics of asian americans (many of whom are also immigrants) as a category: http://www.equality-of-opportunity.org/assets/documents/race... . If you look at table 1 on page 56, you can see that for white americans, the probability of a child ending up in the top quantile of income where a parent is in the bottom quantile of income is 11% (about half the probab…
There might be some hard to account for factors. Many immigrants end up in worse jobs than they had in their home countries. Some doctors end up driving cabs for instance. If your parent is a doctor with the income of a cab driver I'd expect you to have more upward mobility than if your parent is a cab driver with the income of a cab driver.
While anecdata can be useful in general, in this particular case I have a hard time believing that the case you describe: working in a worse job than your home country, is informative or representative.
There is a wisdom of crowds at work, especially when it comes to huge decisions such as immigration - no country offering worse prospects is ever the target of large scale immigration.
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#47Title editorialized from "Intergenerational Mobility of Immigrants in the US over Two Centuries" Abstract: >Using millions of father-son pairs spanning more than 100 years of US history, we find that children of immigrants from nearly every sending country have higher rates of upward mobility than children of the US-born. Immigrants’ advantage is similar historically and today despite dramatic shifts in sending count…
So, the American Dream as upward mobility for established citizens was never true?
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#48That’s because (legal) immigrants have high social capital (education, values, two parent households) and often migrate to places where they have the highest relationship capital (hence the CountryVille neighborhoods like Koreatown or the Ukrainian neighborhood on the East side of Manhattan). So when you measure their kids income it jumps up on average.
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#49Earlier quoted context omitted.
I do. That statement is a platitude.
You know what “strong” and “weak” mean. Should we also define what constitutes “hard times”? Or what “men” are? If you have an issue with the statement, just say it. Don’t hide your criticism behind supposed ambiguity.
Ok, easy, I've seen this statement used several times to criticize younger generations because things were harder "back in my day".
I think that in aggregate, generations are more or less the same, so I don't agree with it.
Re: Children of immigrants have higher rates of upward mobility than US-born
#50It's particularly interesting to look at the mobility statistics of asian americans (many of whom are also immigrants) as a category: http://www.equality-of-opportunity.org/assets/documents/race... . If you look at table 1 on page 56, you can see that for white americans, the probability of a child ending up in the top quantile of income where a parent is in the bottom quantile of income is 11% (about half the probab…
Something that many HNers will probably be embarrased to admit being surprised by is how higher education attainment rates for immigrants don't exclude African immigrants. In fact, black immigrants from Africa and the West Indies have among the highest degree attainment rate of any group. This belies the lower college-and-advanced-degree attainment rate for black Americans as a whole. All of this seems to suggest tha…
"...there is something about the American education system - and perhaps our overal culture - that is failing our children..."
Perhaps the whole idea that there's a "system" that's responsible for everyone's success is the problem?