Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

tesla.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 658 posts

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#91

Post by oxplot »

Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #20
winternett wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The system isn't AI based... It's currently based on static programming. This is why a development team would have to think of every possible scenario that could happen on roads to make self driving cars really work. You'd have to ask all kinds of wild questions too like: "What if kids played a prank and re-painted road lanes on a highway at 50MPH?" "What if a sand storm happened?" "What would the car do if a tire bl…

> than your home computer can handle, much less the components in Tesla cars. Ehm a recent Tesla has very powerful specialized hardware, developed in-house, which is much more powerful than a commodity home PC with expensive GPUs. You might want to do some basic research before you make such claims... > The system isn't AI based... It's currently based on static programming A large neural network is used to make many…

> it does not have to be flawless, it just has to statistically cause fewer accidents per kilometer/year than what human drivers cause in a similar situation (which is already non-zero, and in some countries actually quite high).

Even though it logically makes sense, there are some nuances to it, most prominent of which is: When human drivers cause accidents, they are held responsible by the legal system. Who's responsible when your car made the decision? Is it Tesla? Is it the driver? Society is probably not going to accept a small improvement over humans while all the legal burden goes up in the air. It may demand a much higher improvement to compensate.

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#92

Post by winternett »

quantdev wrote: post #73
winternett wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From your own cited source: At this level, the car can act autonomously but requires the driver to be prepared to take control at a moment's notice.[103][104] HW1 is suitable only on limited-access highways, and sometimes will fail to detect lane markings and disengage itself. In urban driving the system will not read traffic signals or obey stop signs. This system also does not detect pedestrians or cyclists,[105] a…

What does hardware 1 and AP1 have to do with the latest hardware and autopilot?

Because each individual car is not truly autonomous when it comes to learning and improving diving based on it's specific geo location. I am not talking specifically about Tesla, this goes for all automated cars...

We have to be able to admit that we aren't ready to launch thousands of these cars out on streets at this point. They have NOT been perfect.

There are tons of issues beyond just the quality of the AI. Software development and updates, vehicle maintenance, planned obsolescence of models, Legality, ethics, ownership... tons of other issues not hashed out. The combination of all of those issues makes autonomous vehicles near impossible any time soon, unless we ALL want to give up our right to own personal property and submit our safety to being test subjects. I'm not willing to do that at this point as a development manager myself.

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#94

Post by ReidZB »

tjoff wrote: post #24
modeless wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla doesn't use lidar. They have always used radar, but radar can't always tell the difference between a stationary metal sign near/over the road and a stalled car in the middle of the lane, so for stationary objects they need the cameras. This is why every adaptive cruise control system (not just Tesla's) has a warning that it may not detect stationary objects. https://arstechnica.com/cars/2018/06/why-emergency-br…

Though only(?) Tesla pretends that their adaptive cruise control is full blown self-driving.

I'm not sure about what they've said in the past, but their site is pretty clear about the current state of Autopilot / Full Self Driving: https://www.tesla.com/model3/design#autopilot and for a more in-depth description: https://www.tesla.com/support/autopilot

Adaptive ("Traffic-aware") cruise control is actually an Autopilot feature, not FSD. Of course, Autopilot is a debatable name in itself, but Tesla does not market cruise control as FSD, at least not anymore. (I don't know if they ever did or not — honestly I didn't follow Tesla news until like 3 months ago.)

The closest thing to self-driving you get with the FSD package is "Navigate on Autopilot", which is something akin to "self-driving on highways only in good weather conditions". It can also drive around a parking lot on its own if you're supervising it, and it can supposedly park itself, though I've heard Autopark does not work well.

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#95

Post by Erlich_Bachman »

aguyfromnb wrote: post #67
Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? If you simply refer to it being called "autopilot", cmon that's not too serious. The word "autopilot" does not automatically mean that it is full self-driving. None of the Tesla drivers or potential Tesla buyers realistically think that it has level 5 self-driving yet. UPD: The buy page literally says: "The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous. Th…

> Source? If you simply refer to it being called "autopilot", cmon that's not too serious The Model 3 Builder literally says: "Full Self-Driving Capability".

Did you just read the one sentence and not any other text on that page?: "Coming later this year: Automatic driving on city streets.",

Oh and how about "The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous. The activation and use of these features are dependent on achieving reliability far in excess of human drivers as demonstrated by billions of miles of experience, as well as regulatory approval, which may take longer in some jurisdictions. As these self-driving features evolve, your car will be continuously upgraded through over-the-air software updates.".

- Which I just copy-pasted from the exact page you are talking about. Who is being disingenious here?

I honestly don't think that there is any significant number of potential buyers who go onto a website to buy a car, and pull one sentence from that page out of context, ignore the rest of the text and then make their decision based on that.

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#96

Post by ricardobeat »

throwaway55554 wrote: post #14

Awesome! Now do it again and when it passes one set of parked cars on the side, have someone roll a soccer ball in front of the Tesla. Will the car assume a child will follow from in between the cars or not?

Say what you want, but you would never be able to avoid a crash like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqHtavx-eec

Or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uqA9bqICEk

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#97

Post by dx87 »

calebegg wrote: post #19
dylan604 wrote: post #2

I have often wondered about this, so I do find this interesting. Of all of the info presented, one question I have is how does the AI decide when to go at a 4-way stop? In real life, I'm am constantly amazed at how confusing a 4-way stop is to humans. Not that I ever had any doubt into how complicated real-time video analysis could be, this just makes my appreciation of the complexity of the problem that much more qu…

The proper rules[1] of a 4 way stop are probably pretty straightforward to encode, and probably easier for a computer to apply than a human, but the real issue is that you can't trust the other drivers (or AIs) to understand/follow them consistently. So the interesting part is how these kinds of systems can almost instantly react when another driver starts to go, and let them go. In NYC, where I live now, the de fact…

The car stopping if another car goes before it brings up another issue. If self driving cars start showing up on the road and are recognizable, you'd be able to "bully" the self driving cars since you know it'll always give right away. Imagine being stuck on an on-ramp behind a car that is programmed with infinite patience and extreme risk aversion; you could be sitting there quite a while.

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#98

Post by Bedon292 »

aguyfromnb wrote: post #67
Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? If you simply refer to it being called "autopilot", cmon that's not too serious. The word "autopilot" does not automatically mean that it is full self-driving. None of the Tesla drivers or potential Tesla buyers realistically think that it has level 5 self-driving yet. UPD: The buy page literally says: "The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous. Th…

> Source? If you simply refer to it being called "autopilot", cmon that's not too serious The Model 3 Builder literally says: "Full Self-Driving Capability".

Autopilot is a separate feature from FSD. It also specifically lists out exactly what it can do. And includes a whole paragraph on limitations which starts with "The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous."

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#99

Post by FireBeyond »

anchpop wrote: post #59
Traster wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two issues, first: I thought fully autonomous driving was meant to be done by now? Second, don't Tesla & SpaceX have a reputation for being a terrible place to work, with Musk expecting everyone to be working as hard (or harder) than him, and firing people in weird and capricious ways.

> I thought fully autonomous driving was meant to be done by now? It was, but software often goes over-schedule, especially in a brand new field.

The prudent thing to do there, would be to exercise prudence. Not announce to investors and the public ever more grandiose targets after each miss.

As it is we're on about Autonomous Driving Promise Mk IV from Musk, "fully autonomous, coast to coast, by the end of 2020". (That's after 2018 was missed. Which was after 2016 was missed.)

Re: Tesla's self driving algorithm's overlay [video]

#100

Post by daniel2x »

WrtCdEvrydy wrote: post #69
ArtWomb wrote: post #7

I believe this was released as part of Tesla's Autopilot hiring announcement. More details here: https://www.tesla.com/autopilotAI Definitely someone's dream job ;) I particularly like the applicant query: "Tell us, what extraordinary work you have done?"

"Tell us, what extraordinary work you have done?" I wrote code that worked.... I like boring things.

You may be trying to sound snarky, but that is truly extraordinary in todays world!
Post reply on HN