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Not everyone has an internal monologue

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Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#871

Post by tripzilch »

tempestn wrote: post #719
hnick wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me personally it seems to make it impossible to get to sleep. Which makes me tired, and less resistant to rambling trains of thought. Repeat ad infinitum.

I don't usually have this issue, but when I do I find just focusing on breath, meditation style, helps. As soon as you notice yourself thinking, acknowledge the thought gently, and then let it go. At least for me (with a bit of practice) this can head off any thoughts before they can get started, and eventually allow things to quiet down.

Also, acknowledging the fact that, since I'm in bed trying to sleep, I can't act on these thoughts right now anyway, so I don't really need to have them right now (and trusting that if it's important, they will probably come up again at a more useful moment).

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#872

Post by zzo38computer »

Sometimes I do have internal monologue (although I cannot actually hear it) and sometimes it isn't. And sometimes I don't know the words for what I think of. When reading English writing it is a kind of pronouncing, but if it is Chinese (or other ideographic kind of language) then it isn't. When thinking of my own stuff is again different from this. (English is the only language I can write/speak well; the others I am not so good at.)

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#873

Post by yarolig »

I have my inner voice. When I am thinking, reading, writing or typing I imagine neutral young male fast-speaking voice. But I can imagine other voices and tones.

It is hard to stop this inner voice. But I know a trick. I can start to think in foreign language that I know, than switch to another foreign language in which I know only 10 words. The voice is stopped for a few minutes.

Now I understand why I dislike my own audible voice. Because it is not MINE! MY voice is inside my head and it sounds different. I do not speak much but think a lot.

Moreover. When I going to say something non-trivial, I usually saying it silently inside my head and only after it I can say it aloud. I looks dumb in that moment.

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#874

Post by Darmody »

jeznav wrote: post #408
echelon wrote: post #65

I dream up movies and songs and all sorts of rich fantasies in my head, and I do this constantly. As a consequence of this, I never get bored as I've got an incredible imagination to lean on. I think about movies I want to make, startups I want to create, the change I want to put into the world. New songs on my commute, goals I want to accomplish, what I could do with time travel. I'm always working on the structures…

I can relate, as I do this all the time, being inside my head, a mashup of multi-verses, projecting myself in alternate realities, being able to time-travel in to the future and opening a conversational 1-on-1 portal to my present self, to answer the question like Dr. Banks from the movie Arrival or when Brand reaches out to her past self in Interstellar, all while taking bus home, or while taking a long shower. I ca…

I can do all the things you mention. I do also have a hard time "turning my brain off". Actually, I don't think I can do it. But I do have a way to sleep quickly.

It may not be the same for you but you probably can adapt it to whatever suits you. It's about coziness.

There are several cozy scenarios that are ideal for me to sleep. I just teleport myself there and I do stuff.

My favorite by far is the one in the wilderness. I read a book once about a guy from the neolithic who had to run away from his village with his dog. I imagine myself there. There's nothing around me. Only several small villages kilimeters away. I'm alone with my dog. The sun is almost set and it's getting chilly. There's a little cave nearby where I can take refuge for the night. I'll go gather some wood and make myself confortable inside. Then I'll sit by the fire eating some of that smoked meat I have left and I'll just rest my head down. At that point I'm already sleeping.

If you try this, report back.

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#875

Post by not_kurt_godel »

jkhdigital wrote: post #774
hoseja wrote: post #730

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the parent, but the general process would be: form a kernel of a thought, this is largely subconscious process. This thought is made up of meaning-and-context-rich symbols specific to my mind. Refine this thought, resolving contradictions and various logical weakpoints. Translate this thought into speech, losing much of the information content because language is a tool created to holler at your fellow hominids a…

Language is a way of communicating abstractions from one abstraction machine to another; of course information content is lost, but that is only because it must be transformed and compressed to fit into the narrow channel of audio signals that humans are capable of both producing and detecting.

Well said. And in relation to primal psychology (hunting game on the African savannah and hollering at fellow hominids), our ability to convey abstractions and stories through language is an integral part of what makes us human. So the view that language is just a utilitarian tool and not much more is myopic to me. We are social creatures, and whether you consider yourself an introvert or an extrovert, sharing thoughts with others is inextricably woven into your biology. A rejection of this concept is, to me, a rejection of a deeply important part of life and what it means to exist as a sentient being. It often bothers me to interact with people who have this attitude; it's like trying to talk to them through a glass barrier that they refuse to take down.

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#876

Post by not_kurt_godel »

jamiek88 wrote: post #849
not_kurt_godel wrote: post #688

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I definitely am capable of thinking non-verbally, and I agree it can help with programming. But I just can't wrap my head around not having an internal monologue at all. How did you even write this comment? What was the process that led you to put together this particular series of words, if not 'hearing' them in your own mind as an expression of your thoughts first? Edit: Thinking on this more, I may not have had an…

This fascinates me as I remeber this moment too - I was about 5 or 6 though and it was going into my grandmothers back garden through an arch and I was like fully 'awake' for the first time - I had vague feelings of memories prior to this but I do remember the voice becoming aware. I've never had anyone else remember or experience this before and I think its important.

That's really cool, thanks for sharing! Based on your and another poster's response, it seems like there is some wide variation in the age at which this moment might occur (I'm skeptical that the other poster who said they were 3 had the 'same' moment you and I are talking about, but it seems similar enough in this particular context). This begs the question - are there people who never experience this event??

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#877

Post by numtel »

hipjiveguy wrote: post #861
jodrellblank wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much describes The Last Psychiatrist's writings about Narcissism and The Matrix generation. "When the time comes the Universe will make it so I save everyone and know Kung-Fu, because I'm innately a hero so of course it will". https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2009/03/what_was_the_matrix....

I always thought the Matrix missed a huge philosophical opportunity. Instead of humans feeding the Alien/AI need for energy (batteries), they feed their need to be human. They tap into the dreams, and lives of humans, not for energy, but for their souls. They need each individual human, and through infinite permutations of life, with infinite combinations of love and hardship, through infinite Matrix's, are the ultim…

This sounds a lot like Robert Monroe's Loosh idea.

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#878

Post by behnamoh »

triangleman wrote: post #768
behnamoh wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

exactly! I'm so tired of this ongoing voice in my head which is more like a constant noise that takes control of my emotions and disrupts my productivity.

Have you ever seen the film _Revolver_?

no but it seems I should.

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#879

Post by rendall »

I used to have an internal monologue when I was a kid, but it felt less efficient, so I trained myself out of it by around 20. By most objective measures it did make my thinking more efficient but reduced my wit and articulation.

I do imagine conversations with people though, usually when I'm trying to work out how to say something. When I figure it out, I stop the imaginary conversation. Occasionally these imaginary conversations become so vivid that I'll actually speak out loud. It's a quirk of mine that my friends and family giggle about. In my defense, Adam Smith did this too, so I'm in good company.

Re: Not everyone has an internal monologue

#880

Post by rendall »

jhayward wrote: post #442
oh_sigh wrote: post #431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has gotten me into a lot of trouble in my life. I don't use internal monologue to read - that means that I can be reading and listening to someone at the same time, and comprehend both. But, even if I can prove I heard and understood everything someone said, they inevitably view it as rude if I am reading something while listening to them.

I used to get in so much trouble for this in primary/secondary school. Listening to someone talk was boring beyond belief. So I read sci-fi in class. I could always respond correctly when called upon, and could recite virtually word-for-word the entire class lecture if need be, so I eventually got a pass to just do my thing. At this great distance in time I can see how this was impolite to say the least. But, really,…

Interesting. Do you program? If so, can you at the same time both program and comprehend, say, an audibook or podcast? Or even talk to someone?

A colleague told me once that he listened to podcasts while programming and I found that intriguing but baffling. I can do it but only if my task is rote, and I have to turn the podcast off if I'm truly concentrating.

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