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Educated Fools

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31–40 of 281 posts

Re: Educated Fools

#31
post #20

as Chinese lives in uk, they had been my questions for a long time: why did you guys voted for david cameron, barack obama, (any politician, really) at all? had they ever struggled to pay their bills? do they really feel your pain?

Why would people from UK vote for barrack Obama?

barrack Obama was super popular in UK. the day he was elected, his speech was played everywhere in Manchester, over and over again.

my questions were for US voters as well.

Re: Educated Fools

#32

> But the truth might be something closer to this: “It’s only because of race that we have any part of the working class turning out for us at all.” I’ve thought a lot about this, and wondered if we’ll see a major flip post-Trump (perhaps a few more presidencies past), where the republicans somehow manage to shed their racial baggage and suddenly are the party of the entire working class while the Democrats are left…

I fully expect that to happen. Just tossing my two cents in the hat.

Re: Educated Fools

#33
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or middle class people of any race: https://www.politico.com/news/2019/11/05/trump-latino-poll-0... > But according the Telemundo poll, nearly two-thirds of Latinos said they wouldn't vote for a candidate who describes himself as a “socialist.” Sanders identifies as a democratic socialist.

I’m not sure what that has to do with political correctness, seeing as how socialism is a political theory about economics, not about politically correct language.

I’m talking about OP’s point about the Democratic Party driving a wedge within itself.

Re: Educated Fools

#34

Funny how being credentialed by a proper institution (using this phrase because it is more precise than just "education") is as important as ever for achieving certain social standing and at the same time there is a constant stream of voices preaching "universities are imploding, college is a waste of money," etc.

Both can be true simultaneously, if you expand the concepts. Nobody will disagree that attending an Ivy provides some prestige and social standing. Of the universities imploding, most are smaller liberal arts colleges that can't withstand changing demographics (less college students). College is indeed a waste of money if you don't complete your degree program: you get none of the benefits in the job market, with all the debt you took on-- the worst of both worlds.

Re: Educated Fools

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those jobs tend not to pay as well as jobs that require a career focused college degree (e.g. business, engineering, computer science, and even teaching).

I think getting four years of head-start would make up for it a lot. Plus, not everybody is suited to the career focused college degrees and not everybody should be in them.

I agree with you that everyone shouldn't have to work the sorts of jobs that require a degree. However, as long as college is the most effective way to a better job, I think that people are going to keep preferring to go to college.

Hmm, it's a good point that having a four year head start would help balance things. However, I think in the long run things would probably workout in the favor of the person that went to college. Especially in the higher paying majors such as business, CS, and engineering.

Re: Educated Fools

#36
post #6

Man, this is gold. I for long tried to write something along those lines, but I think the author did summarise my thoughts better than I could've done myself. The class conflict — something that western literati class keep denying acknowledgement, is really the driver of much of social progress. And this holds more even more true in the West than in the East. The class warfare is there, it exists, and it is what has…

30 years eh. I think one might argue that "The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles."

Shhh we're busy reinventing Marx as a new idea for the pundit brained technocrats. We need people like Elon and Andrew Yang to tweet it to us before it can be considered cool again.

Re: Educated Fools

#37

In my view, education has begun to act like wealth, because education is a form of wealth, and the productivity divide between wealth and work is increasing. Still, I'm skeptical of the whole idea, because it just seems too convenient for Republicans to drive a wedge between the Democratic party and the working class based on a perceived social division rather than real policy: We took away your unions and safety net…

The Democratic Party is driving a wedge between itself, FWIW. The talking points around political correctness could not be better designed to alienate working and middle class white people.

I've never heard a fellow Democrat use the term "political correctness" to advocate a policy. This could be another fabricated wedge.

Re: Educated Fools

#38
post #20

as Chinese lives in uk, they had been my questions for a long time: why did you guys voted for david cameron, barack obama, (any politician, really) at all? had they ever struggled to pay their bills? do they really feel your pain?

Democracy isn't just David Cameron and Obama, when you go to vote for them, you also cast votes on local precinct leaders, local referendums, and local positions like school board and sheriff. In some places, you might even know those people personally.

Re: Educated Fools

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Democratic Party is driving a wedge between itself, FWIW. The talking points around political correctness could not be better designed to alienate working and middle class white people.

I've never heard a fellow Democrat use the term "political correctness" to advocate a policy. This could be another fabricated wedge.

Racists don't use the term racist to describe what they do either.

Language policing is still big in dem circles.

Re: Educated Fools

#40
Very glad this was written and posted. However, it could have been shorter. If education were indeed the true social value, we could just improve the quality of public education, add an additional year or two to high school, and essentially fold the undergrad syllabus back into the public system. Simply, the purpose of college is to create a culturally separate managerial elite in society.

The basic problem is the legitimacy of the elite it has produced in the eyes of people subject to it. There was always tension, but code changed everything. PhD holding managers today are often functionally illiterate in their domain of responsibility, and that has a huge cultural impact.

There is reliable predictive power in explaining the culture wars of today as the reaction against a managerialist elite using radical cultural change in an attempt to dilute the bargaining power of competent working people, and to insulate itself from a working class from whom they are increasingly undifferentiated.

This is a pet issue of mine, and glad to see it's getting traction, as it's really the defining conflict of today.

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